Defining Hospitality

DH - Henri Munyengango
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Dan Ryan: Today's guest is an experienced designer with a well rounded international background. He's a sought after speaker who seeks to share his knowledge with the design community.

With over 20 years of experience, he's seen numerous aspects of our hospitality industry. He's a regional director of design strategies for IHG Hotels and Resorts. Ladies and gentlemen, Henri Munyengongo. Welcome, Henri.

Henri Munyengango: Hi Dan, thank you for having me.

Dan Ryan: Oh, it's so good to have you here. Um, I wanted to share with everyone how we came to be at this moment.

So we first, well, we've met numerous times over the years, but recently we were at a conference in Arizona and just in advance of me speaking with you, I had spoken to two and now three other people, um, about Rwanda and just how amazed I am by Rwanda as a country. that really had to open up their hearts and see and go through this whole process of reconciliation and understanding, peace and reconciliation.

And I was just very struck because In so many of these conversations, and I don't want to influence your definition of what hospitality is, but it's so much of it has to do with opening yourself up to someone else that's different than you and kind of anticipating what their needs are. Although what I found is there's no real black and white definition.

It's really just a feeling. But it involves two parties, one being open and accepting to letting the other one into their, their space and feeling. And I, so just in speaking to you after coming off the heels of those conversation, I think that we could all learn so much from your experience, and, uh, I'm just really thankful and grateful that you're putting yourself out there and you're here to talk to us.

So thank you.

Henri Munyengango: Thank you.

Dan Ryan: Um, so before we get into the conversation, um, I would just love for you to answer the question of what hospitality means to you or how you define it, and then we can jump off from

Henri Munyengango: Great. Dan, as you just highlighted, I was born in Rwanda, so the way I define hospitality is really through my early childhood memory and culture. In Rwanda, as a growing up little kid, I can remember that we always, cooked more food than we needed for our family. That wasn't because it was a poor planning or anything, it's just every time, never failed that someone really showed up.

Um, Dinner time or lunchtime unannounced and they felt compelled, they were okay to show up, right? My parents created that space where people could just drop unannounced and expected to be fed and embraced.

Dan Ryan: Mmm.

Henri Munyengango: other part of hospitality that I love, which I think it's really what influenced my career and where I am today, is um, As early as I can remember, every Sunday, my parents used to take us to this resort called, um, Resort Acaguera.

It was part of the National Park, and I remember this vividly, um, going through the National Park, seeing all the wildlife, and then the final destination was always Being able to jump into the pool and have those french fries. I can still smell the french fries. Um, the stuff, the way they made you feel.

Um, and having a Coca Cola. So those are things that sticks in my head and that's why, how I define hospitality. And that's why I do what I do today. It's really to... Welcome and create environments that welcome guests, but also really help them create, celebrate memories. Because of all the things that you go through life, memories are one of those things that no one can take away from you.

Dan Ryan: Mmm. And you speak French predominantly, or you grew up speaking

Henri Munyengango: Pas bien sûr. Pas bien

Dan Ryan: Okay, good. So my question is a stupid question. Do you call them French fries in

Rwanda?

Henri Munyengango: sûr.

Dan Ryan: Okay,

Henri Munyengango: Uh, it's, I think it's one of those things that, yes, I, you know, you don't necessarily have to say French fries, you just call them fries.

Dan Ryan: Okay, good. And then it's also interesting because now you're in Atlanta,

Henri Munyengango: That is correct. My home is

Dan Ryan: I'm, so I'm curious if the, those childhood memories of Coca Cola are what drew you to Atlanta, right? Aren't they, isn't Coca

Cola based

Henri Munyengango: That, that is true. Sadly, it's not, but I think it was a benefit. Um, as you mentioned, I was born in Rwanda and grew up in Rwanda the majority of my childhood until the 1994 genocide. And through that period, really, was a Changing moment for me, and the way, long story short, the way I ended up through Atlanta is actually through, um, Catholic Social Services.

But honestly, it was also through that connection that my parents made that were able to sponsor us as kids to be able to come to America. So without Catholic Social Services being able to take us in, and someone really signing up their life to say they would take care of me, I don't know if I would be here today.

Yes.

Dan Ryan: okay, so that's incredible because One of the themes that comes up in so many of these conversations is impacting others, right? And as far as like, okay, yeah, we're all trying to impact, or not all, I don't know about all of us. I always try and leave a room better than when I left it. Or when I got, I always try and leave a room better than when I got there.

And a lot of that is just by, um, in, in small little ways, impacting others. Whether it's people listening to this podcast or having an interesting conversation, kind of coaching someone. Um, But that's, that's me, right? But I think we, what we all do is we all tend to sometimes forget that of all, all those shoulders of the people who came before us that we stand on, from mentors to parents to, um, organizations.

And I think so much of that has to do with hospitality too, because in a room full of people or in our lives, we all have these connections. With other people who kind of help pull us or guide us or teach us. And oftentimes those people don't even know the impact that they're having on us. Uh, and those are like really cool surprises.

So taking your experience of from i I from Catholic, uh, social services and, and leaving Rwanda and coming to Atlanta, um, how has that impacted your idea of hospitality? Or augmented your idea of hospitality from your childhood memories of French fries and Coca Cola's in the National Park.

Henri Munyengango: Yes, um, I'll say I'm very much a product of my environment, obviously, um, as I mentioned, I'm here because other people invested in me, right? So had it not been for, um, Catholic Social Services being able to take my application, my siblings, to trust that I can come here and actually become something, um, had it not been for these family members that really...

accepted us and took the responsibility to take care of us financially, I wouldn't be here. And, um, because at some point someone took interest in me, you know, whether it was just for getting out of Rwanda, being able to make a life here, but that didn't stop there, right? So obviously you have to think, I came here, um, living in 1997 without speaking English.

So I had to take English lessons, um, go to college. And, um, one of the things that people don't realize, as a fresh immigrant who did not speak English, you're very limited in what you can do. So a lot of, uh, my options as far as, uh, income were to work at chicken factories or McDonald's, which went against everything my parents told me.

My parents always told me, you should always go to school and get an education that qualifies you to do something. So it made of a very interesting discussion with, uh. the team that, um, expected us to go work versus going to school. So it was, I was like, no, I cannot go to work. I need to go to school first.

And I remember having this discussion. And, uh, the director at that time was like, well, this is America. You go to work first and the school second. And so I was

Dan Ryan: Wait, the director

from

Henri Munyengango: uh, the Catholic social services, right? No, here in America.

Dan Ryan: here?

Henri Munyengango: Yes. And I remember sitting there and I looked at him and I was like, well, it doesn't seem fair.

I was like, I want to become something. And if I go to work right now, I won't have the chance to go to school. And so therefore I'm going to be limited in my choices and what I can become. And at that moment, it was, what was interesting, that discussion, um, I ended up getting partnered with, uh, his family.

Again, unknown to me. Um, their son was volunteering at Catholic Social Services and wanting to become a doctor. So he joined just now. I believe he, you know, out of his goodness, but when we met we had this connection and somehow they were able to figure out a way of allowing me to go to school and paid for my boarding for at least a year.

which is unusual for somebody you just met, but they really heard our story and liked what we had to say and really believed in me. So to go back to how hospitality has changed for me and or how hospitality has evolved through the lens of my experience, it's through the act of sharing, the act of giving back, right?

Um, I always say that. I'm here because people took a chance on me and believed in me. And so my everyday life, I want to try to do is two things. Create a better environment for, um, our guests to really create and capture those memories. Two is give back to the community. So I do want to foster space for young designers to be able to grow and develop. So those are two things that I really enjoy in my life today, and that keeps propelling me everyday.

Dan Ryan: So, I want to go back and peel back the onion on something where, um, you said, who, it was a young man who said, Or who, what was the, who was the person? You said it was unusual that they said, Oh, you can, they'll pay for boarding and you can go to school. Who was

that?

Henri Munyengango: So, it was this family here in Atlanta, actually, um, and their son's name was Justin.

Dan Ryan: Justin.

Henri Munyengango: And, um, Through our conversation, I've kind of ended up opening up to himself, to him, and I was really sharing my frustration. Um, the whole point to come to America was to, Get a better education, get a better life.

And I felt like what was being proposed was against what I thought of the American dream. So in my frustration, um, you know, I share my goals of going to school and really becoming a member of society that contributes. And I believe that resonated to him because he also was going back to be a doctor. So he went home and talked to his parents and what they were able to manage was to be able to support me for a year. So I could go to school. So I can take English as second language to be able to start actual tech courses. He also actually, um, got me my first job in America as a valet, which allowed me to work on weekends, make enough money to live on, but didn't have to commit all week long. So it allowed me to go to school.

Dan Ryan: So, okay. And then how old were you around

when that

Henri Munyengango: So I came to America 97 and was, I just turned 18.

Dan Ryan: So 18. And when you're having that conversation with the, um, from, uh,

Henri Munyengango: It's kind of also a hmm.

Dan Ryan: Catholic, Catholic social services. You were about eight, 17 or 18 when you had that conversation where you felt like it didn't seem fair, because I had to push back where you said it seems unusual. about what Justin and his family did for you.

Um, I think what's also unusual equally, and maybe more so is how does an 18 year old in a new place being told you have to work instead of going to school, how did you, and you're by some authority figure, right? You're they're saying, Oh no, you got to go work. I think what's more unusual is you. Having the courage to say, that doesn't seem fair, and finding a different way.

Walk me through that whole process, like, how are you, how are you feeling at that point? How did you get up the courage to like, dig your feet in

there?

Henri Munyengango: Yeah. So I have to say growing up, my parents were very proponent for school. Um, it was drilled into us. I, I come from the era where at school at the end of the year, they called out, so they invited the whole entire school, all the parents. So from grade first to grade six, they will start from the best in class all the way to the end of the class.

So if your kid can't last, And it was obvious and it was in front of the whole entire school. So my parents were always, um, what is the right word? Encouraging to come within the top three of each of our classes. So that was something that was set as a goal. So my parents always ask us if whatever we needed to be able, whether it was tutors, whether you need the glasses, whatever it is, they're provided.

Our responsibility was to go to school. So it was no doubt in my mind. Um, That I need to go to school. I need to go to college because my dad always said I should have a piece of paper that says I'm qualified to do something, whatever I choose to do afterwards. It doesn't matter because I need in the end when I need that piece of paper, that's what I can fall on.

So I really took that advice to heart and apply to it every day. And that's why I keep pushing and keep wanting to grow.

Dan Ryan: Okay, I think that that's super unusual, and admirable, that you would kind of... not accept one direction and put another one in like a new place, all new beginning. So I commend you on that. But the other part, the other side of that coin that I think is really interesting and so much of it has to do with so many of these conversations about hospitality is the idea of vulnerability.

Then you're talking to Justin. And you're being vulnerable and saying, I don't, and even, even with the, the Catholic social services, you're being vulnerable also as strong and vulnerable at the same time. Um, and do you, do you attribute that directly to your parents or, or is it, um, cause that, cause I'm also hearing with your parents, it's like, be strong, be in the top three, but how do you.

temper that with that idea of opening up and being vulnerable.

Henri Munyengango: Well, so, I knew school was important, and for me to be able to express it, I had to set the why. And, uh, as somebody who was 18 at the time, coming to a foreign country where I did not speak the language, I really looked at what my life could be, right? Because when we came to Atlanta, we actually landed in not so nice of a neighborhood, right?

We were like south of Atlanta. I'm not going to say this specific area. But it was not what I imagined America to be, and I didn't feel safe. And so I couldn't see really myself living there. Right. So I was just, I couldn't reconciliate like what I had my vision as a person. Also what I thought America was to be able to, like, that was not a reality for me. Right? So it just didn't make sense. And so I had to figure a way to, um, get out of there.

Dan Ryan: So in a way it's like, it's almost like touching a hot stove. You're just like, okay, not for me. I need to find a different way. Okay. I mean, that's incredible. Like I, if I were to go back in a time machine to when I was 17 or 18, I don't know if I, I don't think I would have the courage or the self awareness or the vulnerability.

To be able to kind of dig my heels in and do what you did. So that's really inspiring. And I, and I guess that's a testament to, there's been times in my life and I'm sure in all of our lives who are with everyone listening, where our, our intuition is screaming, this does not feel right. It's our own AI, if you will, right?

But it's a real intelligence where it's screaming and sometimes like I've not listened to that in the past, despite the volume of the scream.

Henri Munyengango: Um, you know, I think for me, I totally agree with that. I was fortunate enough to grow up in a family where I didn't really... needed anything until the war started and I found myself along my siblings and a mother living in a refugee camp in a tent, really begging for food. So for a 13 year old to go from I don't know if you remember this, but like Milli Vanilli had these like cool leather shoes that had like metal.

Um, I remember like crying saying I wanted a pair and of course my parents got them. So, like I really did, you know, I was a little bit naive about life and um... Overnight, my life kind of changed. So I knew if I had an opportunity to come to America, I really needed to take advantage of that opportunity and not waste it.

So that's part of the, the root of why I wanted to, um, go to school.

Dan Ryan: Okay. And then one more point on this one, because when you were talking about the current situation of like the hot stove, if you will, and then the vision of where you want it to be, there's a major disconnect, but then you use the word. You reconciled those two and that kind of helped open the door to the decision making and I feel like that the word reconcile, it means so many different things to so many different people, but as a Rwandan.

How did, like, what does that word mean to you, and what, like, what are like, what's the top learning that you got from that idea of, and, and, and the actions of reconciliation?

Henri Munyengango: Got it. Well, obviously we have a very tumultuous past, so that word really means a lot of things. Um, you know, a few things that come to mind is a self reflection, it's forgiveness, it's being able to look at the past, analyze it, and moving past it. It's also looking forward to the future.

Dan Ryan: so much of that, on the self, self reflection and the analyzation of the past, I feel like, And, and in the hospitality, it's, it's all, it's empathy. It's putting yourself in someone else's shoes to really understand where, Hey, you might not. And I think we could all benefit from this now, just in life of just, Hey, you know what, Henri, I don't agree with you, but you know what?

I'm going to steal me. I hear this word steel man so much, but really it's like, I'm going to put myself in your shoes, even though I don't agree with you. And you know what? I'm never going to agree with you, but I'm going to put myself in your shoes just for a minute. So I can understand where you're, what your life story is and how you are.

And I think that that just opens up a door of empathy and opens our hearts. And, and I think that what we find is that as different as we all are, we're really not, we're all, we all have the same needs and our visions of where we want to go may be different, but like, we're all people. And I think, so I guess, thank you for sharing all that, because I think in.

In this conversation, or the, all of these conversations I've had on defining hospitality, even if it's just like one little drop of water or one grain of sand, um, I'm hoping in some way it may affect some person or some outcome. So, so I appreciate, I appreciate that. And just thinking about putting yourself in someone else's shoes.

So thank

you.

Henri Munyengango: thank you. I do agree with you 100%. I think this. Acceptance is something that I see in hospitality that I really value. Um, I believe as a foreigner, obviously we are conditioned to adapt to, um, a new culture. And so, naturally, as a foreigner, I'm trying to understand the American culture. I'm trying to understand where somebody's coming from so I can learn.

I think what has always been the most impactful is when somebody looks at my name and say, Where are you from? Right? I think that alone, like, that acknowledgement speaks volume and, um, individual, individual who are able to manage that, I mean, that's the ultimate, like, acceptance that anyone seeks for, like, having the curiosity to even inquire.

about your, about one's person or, you know, um, or origin.

Dan Ryan: I, I agree, and, and I know, like, everything that you shared just probably from, from 1994 until you were 18. I don't know how many years that was, you don't have to age yourself right now, but, but basically, your life experience in that arc, I mean, that's, That's an encyclopedia of information and an experience that, unfortunately, we don't have time to dig in right now, and that's not really what this conversation was supposed to be about, but it's leaving me, and I'm hoping it's leaving our listeners, wanting to learn more about where you're from and what your experience is, because, and not just you, everyone, because I think we can all learn from it.

Thank you. and improve as a individual, as a community, as a society, if we just put ourselves in someone else's shoes. And I think that's my big takeaway from all of these conversations. Um, so you wind up acting as a, you're working as a valet, you're going to school.

Is that when you figured out you really appreciated and loved design, or did that happen when you were drinking Coke and eating French fries in the National Park? Like, or has it always been there, or was this something like, you came to America and you're like, Oh wow, this is amazing, and I want to, I want to go down this road.

Like, what was your, how did you know that you were interested in

design?

Henri Munyengango: So I think I've always been interested in design and I won't take credit because the credit actually goes to my existing alum. So when I first came, obviously I took English as second language. And, uh, I went to, um, computer science, um, that was my major that I selected. And I went to my first programming, I believe it was like C I'm not even sure if it's a real thing today.

And, uh, I remember the professor might as well just be speaking Mandarin because I could, I just couldn't see myself, um, quoting. And plus I was surrounded by this kid who had been using computers all their lives and I was really lost. So I remember it was like the longest 45 minutes. So I got out and I went straight to the registrar's office.

I was like, I cannot do this. Um, so, uh, then I was like, okay, what else can I do? And I was like, okay, well, let's just do business administration. After that, I can do anything. So unless the business administration was Doing okay, but I wasn't really motivated. And I remember having this moment with, uh, my sister in law at the time, and I was like, I'm really lost. You know, I know I need to achieve something, but I'm really, I don't feel motivated. And so she looked at me and she was like, Well, have you ever considered interior design? You know, like, everywhere you've lived, you're always, like, rearranging, painting, doing all these things. Well, have you ever considered that?

And I was like, culturally, I was like, I can't do that. I was like, that's, that's a woman's job. Like, what, what would people think? I remember that was, like, the first reaction that I had, because I was like, well, that's not what my parents really would have expected of me. And so. And she looked at me and she was like, You're in America now. You can be anything you want as long as you're happy. And so, I remember I wrestled with that thought and, uh, I talked to my brother and I said, I don't know, I'm conflicted. And he was like, what is the worst that can happen? Just go tour a college and see what happens. And I remember, uh, went to a tour school.

I came back, I couldn't stop talking about it. And, uh, what was interesting is, um, that same night, They sat me down, and they were like, We can tell you're really passionate about this. And so my brother was like, if you can commit to really take your school seriously, we are offering you room and board, everything paid for.

You don't have to worry about anything. And I remember, at first I was shocked. And, uh, I remember going back to my room and actually crying because I was like, oh my god, I can actually do this. And I remember I went and enlisted and finished like in two and a half years because I was like so like thirsty but also so I didn't want to waste the investment in me so I really concentrated went to school and did really well and um by the time I graduated I had a job.

Dan Ryan: Wow. Okay, so, as I'm hearing you say that, it's, it doesn't seem fair with the, with the, uh, the advisor. It's, the bad, or no, sorry, the bad neighborhood.

Henri Munyengango: Yeah.

Dan Ryan: I don't want this. It doesn't seem fair. The going into computer science, I mean like, wow, this is, there were a lot of hot stoves, right? And even before that, and you know, obviously, war.

Coming to a new place, but I think underlying there is just, I think, I think we all need to pay more attention to the hot stoves in our lives because what all those hot stoves did for you is it, it helped uncover a passion that you didn't even know was there. Right? That's crazy. That's like, the odds of that, because did you say a chicken, chicken, restaurant or chicken

plant

Henri Munyengango: It was the chicken plant, yes. That was literally where, yeah, where they wanted me to go to work, and I was like, I don't see myself there. Right.

Dan Ryan: Yeah. So, and again, you, and you said it so well, it's really, um, it's all, it all comes back to the why, like finding our whys and our passions. It's a, it, it took me forever, even when it was staring me in the face and it took other people looking at it and saying, Oh, this is you. You love the journey, like, it's there, like, figure that out.

And I was like, oh, I do? And I didn't even know it, and it was there. And, um, so that's on one side, it's just there staring in the face, you don't know. For you, you didn't even know what it was. So, and you were, so like, so many of these, um, curveballs or hot stoves were, it just kind of, it bent your, your arc into some, some other place.

Henri Munyengango: Um, I was fortunate. Culturally we do encourage, um, community. Um, so I grew up a wanting to please my parents, but also I was always curious to understand what was expectation or what their council was. So, um, to this day I still use that I feel like intuitively sometimes where I'm a roadblock. I just can reach out to someone, give them a perspective, and more often than not, they're able to give another perspective that did not consider that makes it actually sense.

So really all these hot stuffs happened because I got to a roadblock, I reached out and somebody was able to help me workshop through I was going through to find the right solution.

Dan Ryan: Someone, a mentor, or a mentor, or someone who just cared, who was there for you to help ideate. Okay, and then, so now you've gotten your degree in design. What, give, give another example, like, okay, so now when you get your first job, Who's someone that kind of helped lift you up on their shoulder and said, Oh, I like you.

I'm going to get you up there. So you took that step onto someone else's shoulder and like, tell us that experience because ultimately I want to get around to the second thing that you said. It's really, you know, making things better for your guests, but really giving back. So I want to hear like, you have all these great examples and I want one more of just, Someone saying, hey, check this out.

And then how are you paying that forward? If you will?

Henri Munyengango: so what has been, well, by the time I graduated, I was fortunate enough to have, um, a position with a design continuum. I was in, at the time, I mean, I think it still is a small firm, but which it was kind of like the sink or swim. And my manager at the time, she was really good. She was an HBA and, uh, she really took a

Dan Ryan: Who was that?

Henri Munyengango: Holly Kappas. Yes, um, and she took a shot on me and she really gave me every opportunity, um, by the time I started, but I showed that I was interested and I also put the hours, right? As a newbie, if she gave me an assignment and I didn't understand it, I would stay up, you know, this is before the internet, so like, I would, you know, stay up and, uh, read it up and figure it out.

And by the time she came in the morning, I had everything ready. So she really, yeah. Took a shine on me and started giving me more opportunity, started allowing me to, um, to be in those critical presentations with her. Being able to hear back the client's feedback, coaching me. And, um, I remember we, uh, she had allowed me to develop this concept and, you know, I fell in love with it and the client didn't really receive it very well.

And so I remember I was so upset. And she finally sat me down and she looked at me and she was like, Henry, I know you're passionate. I was like, but he's like, at the end of the day, this is a business. And she, you know, she was probably more direct. She was kind of like, is this your money? Right. And so that kind of actually opened my mind because I've always wanted to create a beautiful environment for guest experience. But I never really consider it something that is not really taught in design school, is the business aspect of it, right? This beautiful environment, our investment to our owners, um, clients who need to make a living out of it. So... That really shifted my mind. So again, it went back to the why. So as I start creating and, um, getting this opportunity to present, every time I will get a pushback, I'll learn how to ask the why.

Because with the why, it helps me solution better.

Dan Ryan: And in your experience with that idea of the why, if you're, if you're at a hot stove moment, right, or you're just trying to solve a design problem, and you're kind of in a, in a, backed into a corner, from your experience, like how many times What steps does it take to ask why before you find your path?

Henri Munyengango: I think it's, it goes back to self reflection. Um, you know, I try, I give myself three... opportunities. If I can't get it on my own, then I seek advice. It doesn't mean I have to take the advice, but it gives me a different opportunity. And sometimes I find that by even discussing it, even when I'm sharing it out loud, sometimes a thought or something comes out, um, comes out of it that I'm able to shift my mindset or seeing a different perspective. So I really like to leverage it. No one is better than, you know, multiple heads, you know, together, and I strongly believe in that. So I try to leverage others when I can.

Dan Ryan: So, for lack of a better metaphor, Holly was like a very powerful or sturdy stepping stool for you on your career arc to where you are now. And then, going into your why of, you know, making environments better for guests, but also, you know, paving the way for new leaders, or being that stepping stone for new leaders, um, What are ways that you're doing that?

Because I think it's something that's really important that all of us need to do, um, and do more of, is really find those people who are in our world, who maybe want to get to where we are, and just, just by sharing experience, or taking them under your wing, or giving them a stone to step on, it doesn't have to be a lot.

Like, I, I help coach some kids, on writing their college essays. It's like a fun couple month activity. Um, usually for their first generation kids and, um, first generation here into the U. S. first time going to college, English is probably their second language. I get a lot from that. I don't necessarily talk to them when it's all done, but I think they get a lot from it and it helps them.

And it's like, it's kind of just like. Throwing a pebble

into a

Henri Munyengango: Well, you're, you're the Justin in a way, you know?

Dan Ryan: Yeah. Yes. Yeah, exactly. I'm there, Justin. Although Justin was, seems much cooler than me. So, um, yeah, how are you doing that and how can other people like look around them and I don't know, just find those people who maybe need, or not maybe need, because a lot of it, it's a two way street, right?

How do you, how do you find those people who are maybe want to take that step? And what do you, and how do you nurture

that

Henri Munyengango: So I think the opportunity to be a mentor, of course, is everywhere. So fundamentally, day to day, it starts with my team every day. You know, I look at them, you know, I really take joy in mapping out their journey and where they want to go and really pushing them to get to that next level. So that's like my every day.

It's part of my role, but I really also enjoy it. It's almost like they'll consider it as a job because It gives me fulfillment because I feel like I am giving forward. On top of that, I do, when I can, try to be on a panel and a judge panel on some of the schools here in Atlanta to be able to, again, give that fresh perspective to a potential student.

I do have opportunity to speak to and be on panels that also allows me to. platform to be able to share my voice directly. But sometimes even after that, I do get like, you know, calls or emails in touch point with some of the student or, or even prospective employees, right, who are looking to hear. But what I enjoyed the most is hearing from.

Individuals who have a similar background, right? Like, that have that resilient story. People who came to this country, um, not speaking the English and by wanting a better life, really wanting the American dream to be able to help them share my journey and share the tools I've learned to get them to the where they want to go is a privilege.

And, um, I don't take it for granted. You know, I, I, I thank those individuals who invested me to allow me to be at a place here in my life where I can give back.

Dan Ryan: Um, this came up in a conversation the other day, but it's, uh, really, it's, you're coaching others, right? Especially the ones on your team and Matt, you said, I think you said mapping out their career journey and so much of that is just taking a blank piece of paper, drawing a line down a page and saying, what do you like doing?

And what do you not like doing? And all those, what do you don't like doing all those hot stoves? There's, there are people that love the hot stoves, right? But if you like, and you feel that you're better at, The other side of the page, it's really important that we can all find help and experience on how to get to that other side of the page.

Look, there's always going to be hot stoves in our life. I love that metaphor, by the way. There's always going to be hot stoves in our life and, but we, we just need to minimize them. Because if we're ever at a point where there's not any. Like I'm thinking like maybe some crazy A list celebrity where they're just in this like bubble and like I call it like a cone or a bubble of enablization.

There's just not, um, there's no hot stoves and then you become disconnected from reality. But I think, I think it's really, um, I think it's really important that we all check in with ourselves and those around us to see how we can find that

path.

Henri Munyengango: I agree. I mean, one of the places in my career as a designer I really loved was obviously everyone loves, you know, the conceptual design because it's beautiful, you get to dream. But where I really come alive is during that CA when things are not aligned. And you have to find the solutions. I really thrive on that because, um, I like to see in the end where the vision started with Landon and making sure that the, that thought carry through to the end without any, you know, with all the adversities.

So that's one of the things I enjoy, um, about Our profession is because it changes every day, and it always poses challenges, and we always, you know, we have to be there to, um, meet the challenge.

Dan Ryan: Yeah. Thank you for sharing that. And for those of you who don't know, CA is

Construction

Henri Munyengango: That is right.

Dan Ryan: right? So it's, but basically I find that this is a really great tool. When the concept is done, let's say you have a rendering and it looks perfect, right? And everyone is approved, we're moving forward.

And then the execution, maybe it's not a 10 out of a 10, maybe it's a 9 out of 10, or an 8 out of 10, and different elements. I always find a really powerful question is like, what would make it a 10? Right, if you really, and that gets into a why as well. But it's like when, and it could be, you know, if you have, if you're giving someone a review and you have values on like, Being tenacious.

You could be like, how would you rate yourself on a scale of 1 to 10? Oh, I give myself a 9. Well, what would make it a 10? And just asking that question, it helps bridge that gap. And, and it, that in a way is making, creating that road map for how you can continually improve, right? Because then it becomes something tangible.

So if you're doing a punch or construction administration on something and it's an 8 or a 9 out of 10, By figuring out how to bridge that gap, it gives you tangible things to do. It's those stepping stones that you can get it done.

Henri Munyengango: Exactly.

Dan Ryan: So I want to go back to number one, as far as you're giving back and really making a better environment for the guests. So I know that that's where you really light up is on that. I guess that construction administration, though, and bridging the gap is part of that, right? That's probably the final, the final mile, so to speak.

But, like, if you were to explain how that drive to make a better environment for the guests, like, where does it come from and, like, what does that

mean to you?

Henri Munyengango: True. Honestly, it goes back to the early childhood memory. Uh, perhaps it's because that's the part of, um, My life, I remember socializing with my parents, right? Um, but even as an adult, I find the best memories that I have are from trips or dinners, something that reminds me of the whole experience. So, you know, I know we touched base on like my career as an interior designer, but I also kind of took a little side trip and went to sales to kind of test it out, um, see how sales was going.

I found out quickly that was not for me. I am not a salesperson. I felt like I was missing design, the creativity part of that was missing. The businesses,

Dan Ryan: stove.

Henri Munyengango: exactly. So the,

Dan Ryan: But I love it. So hot stove for you. I love it. That's a great

Henri Munyengango: exactly. Um, And so coming to IHG made more sense because I didn't want to go back to the design. I wanted to work, um, with brands to understand how brands come to life. What is the ethos of each brand? How, what is it they're trying to do? Because again, it's going back to creating that journey, that experience.

Creating a map from arrival to the private guest room. What is that thread looks like? What is it we want the guest to experience at each touchpoint? Um. There's no greater way to do it than partnering with a brand, right? Taking words, aspiration, and putting it into a concrete, physical form.

Dan Ryan: hmm. Mm hmm. I, yeah. And that, and also when I speak to designers and architects on this, I, I, I always share like, it's not my gift at all. I love solving problems, but to be able to take these nebulous ideas or feelings and turn them into like the built environment. That is just amazing. But again, that's, that would maybe be a hot stove for me, right?

I like hearing what that vision is and then making tangible things to get there in, as far as furniture. But, um, when you just have that blank, blank piece of paper or the, the tabula rasa, it's, uh, and then to create a built environment, that's just amazing and inspiring. And again, it's, that's not on the side of the paper for me.

Henri Munyengango: Well, but honestly, Dan, so I, I view this as, it's a collaborative thing, right? Because our ideation, you... Actually materialize it, right? So through the furniture, through the finishes, if we didn't have good resources to pull from, half of what we do would not be successful. Because we are successful because we're able to actually support and create these assets that support our vision.

Dan Ryan: yeah, no, I agree. And it is a collaboration, right? It's a, it's. Someone's the prime mover coming up with the idea, right? And then it's, how do we fill in the blanks and how do we make those intangible things? Maybe I'm not the best at being the prime mover, right? But I'll be the second, I'll be the one there that can be like, oh, that's what you want?

Yeah. Have you thought about this, this, this, this? And then it's like, fine. I'm, and I think that's my why also it's aside, like shortening people's journeys, I say, but it's really like helping find a better way to do something, right? I'm always tinkering and. Just, I want to be that, I love being that collaborative partner to figure out how to get it done.

And then when the, when the shit hits the fan, it's like, okay, well, let me, I got this. Let me figure out how to fix this. So you're not burning calories. Um, this has been amazing. So, thank you for sharing so much about your past. And I, I wanted to, I know we, we were looking in the rear view mirror a lot in the, uh, But like, when you think of your, where you are now and looking forward, what, what are you, what's lighting you up about what, what you see in the future?

Henri Munyengango: Um, I do, unfortunately, because of what I do, there are a lot of work that I cannot speak to, um, but I do have more opportunity to obviously engage more with the audience, share my story from work front, there are great opportunities coming ahead with some of our brands. Obviously having, you know, 19 brands, uh, IHG, there's always something to be done.

So, um, quite a bit of a work, uh, exciting works from coming ahead. On a personal level, um, one of the things I do is really continue to grow. I push myself every day and, um, I look forward to Getting more physical. I wanted to go back to running. Um, I miss doing, um, um, triathlons, so I really want to go back to doing them.

Dan Ryan: Well, good luck to you on that because I can't imagine. I love running as well. I've never done a triathlon, but to train in Atlanta, I don't know how you do it. So that's my hot stove. Literally, it's so hot and muggy down there, but it must make you stronger. Um, cool. And then. Henri, if I were to ask you to magically appear in front of the younger, french fry, coca cola drinking Henri, what advice do you have for yourself?

Henri Munyengango: I will say to the young self is To continue the path he's on, continue to believe in himself, leverages others when he can. I will say don't worry so much about accents. For a while, I really had a complex because coming to a country where I didn't speak the language, I had an accent. It really made me very shy.

Uh, so I used to be hesitant to speak, um, and, uh, I will tell him to actually leverage that because it's his strength and, uh, his uniqueness.

Dan Ryan: Yeah, and I, I would say, um, pay attention to those hot stoves, but it sounds like you already did. I mean, that, like, that's amazing. That is like, so incredible that, um, You were just so brave, brave to like always listen and act on those hot stoves because I think, and if, for me hearing this, um, I'm just hoping that people listening will pay more attention to those hot stoves because our intuition knows what's up.

Henri Munyengango: I believe so. I think in addition to that, really surrounding yourself with the right people. Um, I, I thrive on my little community that really tells me what is real, right? There's no sugarcoating. I have friendship, like we make pacts. It's like, I never want a friendship that tells me that I'm great all the time because no one is that.

So I have, I call them my little, like, board members.

Dan Ryan: hmm.

Henri Munyengango: um, we touch base all the time and, um, we say what's real. And that really, that has kept me progressing. That's given me the drive to continue to grow. So it's not just listening to your internal body, but it's also surrounding oneself with the right mentors to, um, continue to grow.

Dan Ryan: Yeah. Well, I agree. I like the board of Henri. Um, but my other takeaway from this is, um, and this, we don't need to talk about at all, but I'm just going to say it as an observation. If I turn on the TV or listen to the radio or read the newspaper, you'd think that we are living in the United States and it's like the most fucked up place ever.

Sorry for the bad word, but like, just, but hearing your story and. I don't know. I think we got, we're doing, we're doing a lot right. And I, I think it's also about where we pay our attention to, like, stop reading the newspaper, watching TV, listening to the radio, like. We have to chart our own courses and be true to ourselves and avoid the hot stoves at all costs.

Henri Munyengango: I agree. Look, um, I believe in the American dream. Um, opportunities are everywhere. Honestly, when I go back and look, yes, you hear so many things. Sometimes it's easier to talk about the bad things instead of talking about the good things. And I want to change that narrative because They're successful stories every day and I think we need to support those, um, stories and, uh, hopefully that will change the mindset of others and, um, you know, coach one another, you know, if you can assist, can help someone younger get on the right path, do it.

You know, it, it's really a way of paying forward, but it also doesn't cost you that much.

Dan Ryan: Yeah, it's focus. It's what, it's what we're focusing on and, and who we're surrounding ourselves with and who we're taking along on our ride.

Henri Munyengango: you said it

Dan Ryan: has been amazing. Well, I'm just summarizing what you said, but you, I mean, this has been an incredible conversation, Henri. Um, I'm so glad we're having it.

I'm so glad that you're putting yourself out there and, and sharing. Um, so I just want to give you a heartfelt thank you.

Henri Munyengango: Well, thank you, Dan. It's been a

Dan Ryan: Um, yeah, well, it has been, I think more for me than for you. So, um. Thank you. And I also want to thank our listeners. Again, without you guys, we wouldn't be sitting here with Henri and learning from his experience. So if this changed your idea on mentoring, or hospitality, or design, or avoiding hot stoves, actually that, let it, avoid five hot stoves in the next month.

Okay? That's the gift that Henri is giving you. Avoid hot, five hot stoves and just see what happens. Um, but if it has, please pass it along. If you think someone's. Burning their hand on too many hot stoves. Send this to them because, uh, I think we can all learn a lot from all the experiences that we talked to, um, but especially on Reese.

So, thank you all, and we'll catch you next time.