Defining Hospitality

Dan Ryan: Today's guest is a renowned designer, an innovative thinker, a creative entrepreneur investor, and cultural ally, a leader at the cutting edge of the intersection between art technology and cities, founder of deem journal art matter, open docs, open box, and the urban ocean lab.
Also point of note, the first interview I ever did many, many years ago, which kind of gave me the bug to be where we are right now. Also. Uh, a fellow dad friend who I think I first met playing basketball with our kids at the Y on 14th street. Yeah. Ladies and gentlemen, marquees.
Marquise Stillwell: Wonderful to be here.
Thanks so much, Dan. Always good to see you and be reconnected even if it's discovered video. Well,
Dan Ryan: and I, and I just, before we started this, I just want to take a minute and just like, look at your face because like, I just remember seeing you waiting in line at school [00:01:00] or just walking around or whatever.
And I just, there's so many of those connections that are not planned that I miss. And you were definitely one of them. Yeah,
Marquise Stillwell: no, I agree with you. I miss our neighborhood and just the random moments and you know, whether I'm coming out of cafe grumpy, you know, and, and seeing the dog and you guys, and, um, yeah, we've missed those moments.
So, um, it's, it's good to read.
Dan Ryan: It's amazing to reconnect. And again, I say this a lot, but the best time to plant a tree is 20 years ago or today. So here we are today. Love
Marquise Stillwell: it, love it.
Dan Ryan: Um, and also I made a last minute decision not to go to Vegas when you were there recently. And, uh, I missed the panel you were on, but I heard it got some great fanfare and a lot of, a lot of great excitement around that, um, at the hospitality design show in Las Vegas.
And thank you for being a part of our community in hotels as well.
Marquise Stillwell: Yeah, no, I, I, hospitality is so important. I would say it's even more [00:02:00] integrated though. It is quote an industry. I also appreciate the fact. It's the fabric of everyday life, right? It's, it's not some just industry out on its island that you rarely engage with.
I feel like it's something that you consume every single day. Um, whether you just happen to be walking by a hotel, or are you going to a restaurant or you're sitting next to someone that is in the service industry. We're all, we've all been affected by, you know, what's been going on in the last couple of years, and I particularly believe that the hospitality industry is a space that has affected us all and we all need to pay attention.
Dan Ryan: Uh, I couldn't agree more and in doing all of these conversations and coming up with my definition or aggregate definition of what I see hospitality, as you know, it's, it's, it's really about. Being a person and connecting with people. And, and how do you do that? And what's really amazing about it is whatever you can learn in our [00:03:00] industry as an island.
If you look at it in Ireland, it's transferable to everything. It's about listening. It's about seeing it's about caring for others and doing service. Um, it's, it's this intersection of all these things, like you're the intersection of art technology and cities, right. But hospitality is the intersection between just, I think.
Marquise Stillwell: I wouldn't be here without, you know, my job in college. I worked at the Ramada hotel was that was my college job. I didn't, yeah, yeah. For a long time. And I was the earth as the bell man, the door, you know, I pick people from the airport. I worked behind the desk. Um, when we got crazy busy, I folded towels, eight Olympic, the housekeeper bead, you know, worked in the restaurant.
Um, when there was a big convention, you know, we'd needed somebody in the back, helping out. So what I love was that there were so many things going on in a hotel at one time and [00:04:00] I was able to see it all and touch it all just because of just the time period we were living in. When I was in school, but I also, that's, that's a bit of what I love about even our relationship in the end and what it means to live in New York city and walk around and have neighbors and just be involved like you're in that.
And I feel like hospitality, particularly hotels. I think these little cities, they're 24 hours. They never stopped. Right. There's 24 hours worth of activity going on. And it's like a little tiny city. And I learned so much from my job, um, during my college years, which is what has led me to what I'm doing today
Dan Ryan: to tap into that learning.
One of the, one of the main question I ask everyone who comes on is like, based on all that learning. And I want to get into that tiny city metaphor. Cause I love that. Um, how do you define hospitality and what you've learned in aunt on your journey? Now,
Marquise Stillwell: hospitality to me is, is putting people at the [00:05:00] center of everything.
And that hospitality is, is service plus, right? Because there's one thing to serve someone, right? You hand them something, but to actually serve the person and to care about them, to anticipate needs, um, to think about the whole person. Right? So when I was working at this hotel, there was a lot of people that would, these were business travelers and they were there every week, Monday through Thursday, they'd get on a plane and go back to wherever they go.
And then they would come back and get over it. They basically lived at our hotel and being able to be sensitive to their needs, similar to the needs of someone on vacation, who has saved money over months and years to come down to this particular location and be able to spend time with their family.
What are those things? So it's putting hospitality to me is putting people at the center of service.
Dan Ryan: I love that. And when you think about this kind of little city metaphor, [00:06:00] And doing all of the things from, you said from folding towels to driving the shuttle van, to just being there for, for a guest. Um, was there any instrumental or super influential individual in that learning within the hotel?
Got you to this realization.
Marquise Stillwell: Yeah. I mean, there's definitely people who I watched and they guided me and there's a gentleman by the name of Michael when Bush, who was very much instrumental in understanding people's needs and understanding as simple things like this person always wants extra towels, or this person wants extra pen and paper in their room because that's the way that they work and anticipating that, um, and knowing, um, what those needs were and, and never going, oh, that's so simple.
Why it's the simple things that matter most. [00:07:00] Um, and so for us, it's making sure we're showing up. And also when I was at the hotel, everyone wore a tie. Everyone had to wear a suit. And so there was a particular approach, a business approach, not saying that. Look and feel this is still important today, but I'm using it as an example of let's say our presentation and how we actually approached our job was with this seriousness of service and creating this full circle of service was what was really important.
And that's what I got from that, that job.
Dan Ryan: And another thing that resonated with me as you were talking where you did all of these different things, it's even more prevalent right now because all of the hotels are so understaffed right now and occupancy is so down and they're, they're kind of.
Everyone's doing everything. You have heads of rooms checking in people they have. Yeah. You have bellmen folding, [00:08:00] folding towels. And
Marquise Stillwell: absolutely, absolutely. Nothing has changed. I saw when I was in Vegas, I mean, just at the restaurant people, the same person that was checking me in was bringing me my food.
And, you know, it's, it's interesting because in some ways it's a double edge, um, challenge where I think we've lost some of that edge when it came to. Um, the people that were used to, so when you'd go to whether it's cafe grumpy or a bodega or hotel, and you have that person that, you know, all the time that that gets you and it's, there's a sense of comfort.
So we've lost those people, right? So that's why we're, we're we have to double up when it comes to individual capacity. Um, while at the same time, I think it's an opportunity because a lot of times you're, you're in a silo and you don't get to do much. I was always an entrepreneur. Like I I'm an entrepreneur now, but I was always an entrepreneur, meaning that inside of a company, I was always willing and [00:09:00] desiring to do many things.
And I think that's really important, this idea of apprenticeship, which I mean taken off a little Trek, but I think the opportunity is the fact that a lot of the executives of the future may not have ever been a doormat, may have never been a front desk person. They went to business school, they learned all these things.
And so all of a sudden, now they're at an executive level. They didn't put the 10, 15 years and to grow all the way up to GM and the GM to actually executive or owner. And I think that that makes a difference when I actually know what it means to complete a bathroom toilet in a hotel and do the things that a lot of people have never done and then draw my career to be an entrepreneur, because I know that I've done a lot of, you know, pun intended to dirty work and a lot of audio
Dan Ryan: that I actually have never heard the word intrepreneur before.
And I love that. And to tie [00:10:00] it back to getting into hospitality. The skills are transferable to everything. You, you get to touch finance operations guests. Yes. It's like a little laboratory. You said a little city little laboratory where it's
Marquise Stillwell: absolutely. Um, you know, the GM there during the summertimes, I would do.
I created my own internship there during the summertime and basically worked hand in hand with the sales department. So the general manager that allowed me to work with the sales department to do research around the city of basically what I would do is drive around the city, looking at other hotels.
Pre Google and all those things. I would look at what other companies are actually coming there like conferences and seeing if we can cherry pick any of those companies that are going to the other hotels and seeing how I can help to drive that business to the sales team. And I just made that up, you know, with the GM and said, Hey, this is what I would [00:11:00] love to do.
But because he saw that I was willing to roll my sleeves up. He saw me in the kitchen, he saw me doing other things. He was willing to give me an opportunity to step into something that was definitely not qualified to do in regards to sales, but it allowed me to see something that I'd never seen before.
And it's been transferrable to me being an entrepreneur. So,
Dan Ryan: and doing all of these conversations I've been having, I've heard two types of general managers to use that as like the, you know, the CEO of this little city or business. Right. And one kind is. Oh, that's a great idea. Put it in a suggestion box for when you're a general manager.
Right, right. And then the other, the other one. And again, this is why I think these conversations apply to everything. The other general manager is, that's a great idea. How can you execute this? Let's see what you can do. And it's basically enabling and saying, get out there and do.
Marquise Stillwell: Yes. Yes. And I was lucky enough to [00:12:00] have that.
Um, I was lucky enough to have it. It was one of those it's Ramada in, um, university hotel. Um, yes and yes, in Columbus, Ohio. So I'm a Buckeye. And so, uh, it, I think because there was a lot of students and there was an energy there, um, I think that it helped to feed in, into that. Um, you seen us young students really wanting to help and be a part of the community.
I also believe like it was, um, the state of the times as well, where, um, everything has become even more cookie cutter. Um, and in trying to scale, um, hotels in a way that I'm sure we can dive into the mini city of cookie cutter, but I think that. Now that we're such that state and there's, we're now where you're seeing the push up against when it comes [00:13:00] purpose-built and having more community, because one thing that's really important to a lot of the work we do at open box is, is, is showing how communities should be involved.
Um, and I believe that purpose field hotels and brush Ron's that actually reflect the community are the ones of the future. And
Dan Ryan: I really want to dig into this one because I remember we had a conversation a while ago. I think it was at one of the ILC concepts where so often these in even independent hotels, it's almost like a, uh, like a Mars Lander that lands somewhere.
And then it's like this bubble, this hermetically sealed bubble. That's like, oh, we're here, but I want to hear more about like the work that you're doing as this, the intersection between art technology and cities, because. This is exactly what a hotel
Marquise Stillwell: is. No, absolutely. And really for us, but that intersection, the core of that intersection is all about people and people make up a neighborhood [00:14:00] and having neighbors, because if you think about the history of hotels are actually been in neighborhoods, right.
They were above a pub or next to somewhere, and it was like a traveler that would stop and they'd be integrated into the community. And that pub that served as maybe an initial Airbnb or a larger hotel, was it where the city centered around. And then we got to a place where we started to separate the people that were travelers from the people who lived there.
And we started creating these cookie cutter places where you couldn't actually, um, integrate it nicely. And so we, I believe we lost a lot of the experience of trial. And I do, I do believe that the what's really core and the work that we do is trying to bring those two things together to make sure that the experience that you feel as a traveler is the same experience and respect that neighbors feel when you come into town.
And that there is a bit of storytelling that [00:15:00] happens between the two, meaning that the neighbors can see their themselves and the respect of that, that new place in their neighborhood and the people who are traveling there, get to see something. Like, why do I want to keep T to stay in the same hotel that looks exactly the same in Austin, as it does in San Francisco, my even go somewhere,
Dan Ryan: my dad would love staying at.
He loves staying at those hotels that were the same everywhere. So he knew where the iron was. I
Marquise Stillwell: am not my God. I don't want that. You want to experience. And I really believe that, you know, it's, a lot of people can argue what Airbnb has or has not done to the industry. But one thing that I can say about it is that as someone who has, who uses both who consumes both hotels and air B and BS, I do enjoy the process of getting to know and feel the experience of, of a neighborhood and someone else's home.
[00:16:00] And I do believe that there's something there when it comes to that, that intersection of what it means to feel very local. Um, and, and connected with the neighborhood. I
Dan Ryan: agree wholeheartedly. And it's a little story that is making me think of is we moved to Connecticut, so we're out of the neighborhood.
Right. And I was talking to my youngest antebellum and she said, oh, I really miss New York city. And I said, well, what do you miss about it? She's like, well, dad, I just miss walking with you. And you would just talk to random people on the street and just be like, and just get to know them were out of the city.
I miss that. And I do believe that hotels as this intersection, It does offer a, a forum for these collisions.
Marquise Stillwell: Absolutely. I call it, creating the conditions to be surprised. Right. And when you create the conditions, which is what we do as designers, right? Our job is to create better conditions, whether it's, you [00:17:00] know, the proximity to you turn off a light or, you know, the softness of your bed, it's also, you know, things like the lobby.
It's also the location. So when I go to a networking event like Las Vegas, that's why I'm going there. Right. I'm hoping to meet people that I've made have never been able to meet. And they've created this density of network, right? And so we serve that's what hotels are there to serve is to create these conditions, to be surprised, but when it's built and designed in a way to just facilitate.
Movement and logistics of people in and out of their room and into a restaurant and back in, and all the roots look the same. It's losing its soul. It's losing its its purpose is what I really believe. And I think
Dan Ryan: have to get back to that. I can't agree more. And the thing that just jumped out of your mouth at me was this whole idea of density of network.
So two things I've never heard intrepreneur and I've never heard. [00:18:00] And maybe it's because I'm not a right.
Marquise Stillwell: New York is like the density of network. I mean, you know, you and I are around the corner from each other and we would run into each other and see, and we would run it to different people because we were walking.
Yes. Right. And now you're in cars and you don't get to have that, that moment totally spontaneous moment. And that's what, you know, your daughter was explaining to she, there is something there that even kids miss.
Dan Ryan: I see. Yes. And, uh, the density of network. One of the reasons why I like talking to random people on the street is I feel like every person I'm speaking to you, like for you, Marcus, I'm talking to you right now.
You are my gateway to your whole universe. As far as how you see it, the lens through you see it, all of your connections, the person, the next person that I'm talking to. That's my connection to their whole universe. Right? It's like every person is a connection to a whole different universe in a whole different
Marquise Stillwell: perspective.[00:19:00]
Absolutely. Absolutely. And that's where you start to see my other little Saint I'd call the proximity of luck. Right? And so the proximity of luck is that you and I met, you introduced me to, I'll see through ILC, I've met these other individuals through that. It ended up me being on the panel in Dallas, Vegas this week.
Right. And so all of these things, the proximity. Right, which is dependent on the density of the network that allows us to actually build within that network, all these conditions to be surprised, right? It's a full system that is really important. And that's what makes, you know, cities like New York, special and hotels and the hospitality.
We're the host of that, right? So the core of service is the host. And when I would go to a restaurant, I don't want to be [00:20:00] sitting in that restaurant every night by myself. I love a bustling restaurant. I love the energy, the clinking, a blast, the music, the people, even if you're just people watching, it's just very beautiful to be able to fill that density within the network and seeing the proximity of luck that you may sit next to somebody that may be your next, whatever that is.
Dan Ryan: As you're talking about proximity of luck, you're like. You're like my lucky charm in that respect, because again, my first interview I ever did was with you randomly. I think Andrew Benioff asked me to do it,
Marquise Stillwell: but I fuck it. I fucking loved it
Dan Ryan: so much. It was so awesome. And then it led me on to do all these other things.
And now that here where we are and another one that, um, I had forgotten about, but as we were talking and I forgot about Ohio, for some reason you were in DC at the same time as I was, we went up to dinner with Larry Traxler and it turns out that you guys
Marquise Stillwell: went to the same high school together. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:21:00] Same town. He's just like, but even 10, 15 minutes from where I grew up. Um, so we're right there. And I saw, I saw him in Vegas as well. And, and you're right. It's like these moments where the proximity of luck strikes and it's like, oh, we'd love to work with you men. And we already have a connection. Right.
And he, and I could go into a conversation about how we grew up in where we grew up. And though we may say, come from different sides of a, of a track at a certain point of your career, those tracks disappear. And that's the beauty. And in having someone like you, that helps to facilitate and bring in someone like myself, because you know, the, the other conversations that we've had, you know, around race and, you know, social justice and all those things that have been at the forefront of conversation.
One thing is really true is the question of how do you actually [00:22:00] get people into the industry? How do you actually bring new faces in? And to me, what I love is the fact that when someone can ask you that question, you can answer with my favorite answer is that I actually have black. Right. Like, I actually have somebody that I know is a friend and I can call and I can reach out.
You don't have to like really work and think like, oh, what, where do I even start? Right. Because what's key is this proximity to people that are different than yourself, that helps to expand the nodes in your network. And that's, again, what we love about New York city. What I love about hotels, all about restaurants is that it's these intersections of people that are come from different worlds that I get to exchange with.
And I think that that's something else that you and I have talked about. And what I appreciate about you is that you're always willing to reach out regardless of who they are, what they look like. Yeah. [00:23:00]
Dan Ryan: Uh, in doing this podcast as well. I have to say that you through ILC and like some of the comments of some of the panels that were up there, or even other panels that you were referring to, like, you're like, I'm not going to go do a panel if there's no woman on it, right.
I'm not going to go do it if there's no, this, no, that, and I, and it changed my mind to think about, okay, it's so easy to go talk to the people we know. Right. But what harm comes from putting in a little bit of effort to change the perspective and get more diverse opinions. And that's one of the things I love so much about ILC is that they made such a tremendous effort from years ago to promote that diversity of idea of sex, of race, of gender, of sexual orientation.
So where, like, to me, it's like, okay, the more we can do that, the faster we can get to this idea of a star Trek future, where it's like, Hey. Like
Marquise Stillwell: who cares, right? Yeah, exactly. And that's, that's what I go back to the [00:24:00] creating conditions to be surprised. And we need to hospitality right now as a place where we need to rethink our model.
I mean, restaurants, we're already struggling. we need to rethink that model. We need to make it more human and people centered. We need to make sure that people can afford to live and work off of their salary. We need to do the same thing in hotels. We need to make sure that the front staff is just as respected as the office staff and that they have a livable wage.
I mean, I don't know that's a larger conversation, but it goes to every aspect of what it means to serve. If you're in the service industry and you're providing food, you're serving food and you can't even afford the food you are serving. That's a problem. You're now going to serve. With love. Why would you, if you're like passing all these [00:25:00] plates around of steak and potatoes and vegetables, and you're going home eating a bowl of, Hmm, I I'm going there because when you think about service and putting people at the center of service, and that's the core of hospitality, hospitality has to begin with making sure the people who serve are, are, are part of the hospitality of this, the full cycle of hospitality within the business of what we do.
And Dan
Dan Ryan: and I, and again, I think all of that, I've heard you say love, and it's other conversations it's being open hearted and it's like, hospitality is that opportunity to have these collisions increase the proximity of luck, which I love that because if you're not colliding, yeah. You're not moving the ball forward.
Right. It's tapping into that heart wave. I don't know. I sound like some, uh,
no,
Marquise Stillwell: but it is. I mean, people are lifting, sleeping. I [00:26:00] mean, it's a 24 hour city. The hospital hotels are 24 hours, little mini cities, and a lot is happening in those tiny little cities. And if it isn't respected at the human level, then all we're doing is creating these conveyor belts of moving beds, heads, the beds, heads, the beds, and just moving them in and out.
And what's the number, what's your occupancy rate, all those different things. And people are going to get tired of that. And especially this younger generation. And if we don't change our models quickly, and I don't know if it's Airbnb or whoever, but it's going to change
Dan Ryan: and it's also hospitality.
Getting the conveyor belt to me is the same thing. It's like, okay, we're all looking at our screens all the time. Right? How do we put that down and really foster a connection? So if you put the conveyor belt on one side, as far as, okay, this is just phoning [00:27:00] it in average delivery, um, search back in your memory banks, like what is the best experience of hospitality that comes to your mind that you've ever ever experienced?
Marquise Stillwell: Well, what I love about traveling and you know, you and I have, you know, kind of a similar story, like, you know, 150,000 miles a year, we're traveling all around the world and you know, one of the most important things is sleep and what I love, it's not. The bed and in my ability to get a good night's sleep because it's quiet.
It's the process to which I get there. And so when I walked into a hotel and there's particular hotels around the country and around the world that I stay at often because I walk in and whether they know my name or not, some of them do some of them, don't, they at least acknowledge that somehow I [00:28:00] belong there and that they're happy to see.
And that sets me at ease. And so that's the first level of ease that it sets me to. And then the ability to walk into the lobby because the lobby is also could be a very scary place for both women and minorities. So for me, the lobby experience is tough because there have been many times that I've walked into out of my car.
It's happened to me in Detroit. I get out of my car, I'm walking into the hotel and someone throws me their keys because they think I'm the bomb. Yeah, the ballet that's happened three times. It happened in Nashville. It's happened in Denver. It's happened in Detroit and I know it won't be the last time.
My point is, is that that intersection for a lot of women and minorities is a really tough. So as a designer, how might we design the space for, for the visual? Now, obviously there are constraints, right? Not every hotel can be built to say, but [00:29:00] the hotels that really make me feel great is when I've walked into a very open lobby that allows everyone to see the full picture of what's going on and then areas where I can actually sit at and actually have either a private moment to do some work or an open where I can actually see again, this is what I like.
I like the lounge. These are the things that allow me to. Also take on different types of meetings. It's not a place where you'd necessarily need to have food. You can have a drink. So having those places that allow for that, and then the next level of it is something that some people take for granted, but it's the smell.
It's like those little things like pudding, designing, making sure that the hotel has a scent or a smell that's calming and relaxing. Right. And so when you're able to do all the senses, I think that creates some of the best conditions. [00:30:00] And for me, it's the head, heart and hands approach to how we actually, as designers, look at those opportunities to make sure that people feel welcomed and they, they belong.
Uh, I love
Dan Ryan: that. So it's almost like you're on this gentle. To sleep, even though you're not going to sleep, but it's like, here's your routine? Here's your, your however, you, we all have a routine to fall asleep.
Marquise Stillwell: Yeah. But it doesn't start at the bed. It starts with all the things that allow you to feel like you belong.
Dan Ryan: It's also interesting because one of the biggest innovations in the past 20 years, and it was almost 20 years ago or more than it was this heavenly bed that Western did, and it was all about sleep. And I'm like, and I don't know how many innovations there actually have been around that. But if you think about it, you're mostly at a hotel to go to sleep.
So you'd think they put some more time into figuring out how to do it. [00:31:00] And the only other company that I've really seen putting sleep at the forefront is Equinox. They have, it's like part of their whole design. It's like, it's how do we get to
Marquise Stillwell: sleep? Yes. Yes. It's, it's so important. Um, And I know that, you know, some hotels, whether you like the, the addition or others, um, you know, they have the strong set, right.
And Synthes the strongest memory that we have, um, right. It's, it's the strongest trigger. And when you go to a place that smells a certain way, it does put you at ease, it's a familiar smell, and it allows you to say, oh, I've been here before, where I feel good about where I'm at. And that's also something that I would just add as someone travels a lot that sometimes is overlooked.
Um, That's really important.
Dan Ryan: You're totally making me think of a talk that I don't remember if it was Samantha Dawn gold worm from [00:32:00] 12 course. They're my friends. Those guys, they're actually cousins with a really, really good friend of mine as well. Adam Goldberg I'll give him a show. Uh, but they, they, uh, I think it's also a Ted talk, but I saw her do it in person.
And I've been out to dinner with her, where she talks about it. And it's like, um, the scent as you're going through a life experience. Yeah. The scent is. Ties your body to the actual environment you're in. So when you think about memories and setting memories, and you have those pro Stijn, the scent, you smell that thing that brings you back to a childhood memory.
It's that scent that's that like rocket ship back in your memory?
Marquise Stillwell: Yeah, absolutely. And that's, I mean, good. And you know, w we're we're designers, we see the world in a particular lens and it's those little tiny, simple details that matter the most. And again, if we put people back into the center of hospitality and it's about serving [00:33:00] people, how do we actually serve all their senses?
How do we think about how people are feeling? What's the emotional, you know, on a flight for 12 hours, getting off, getting a text message that you didn't want to get, having to call this family member due to all the things that we have to do. Well think that traveling is like, oh my God, this is so fun.
You get to get away. No, I don't get away from anything. If anything, it's more concentrated because I'm out on my own and I'm traveling and I'm pulling my bags. It's it's raining or whatever else is doing. And I want to be able to walk in somewhere and feel like I can be home. I'm not at home, but I can be,
Dan Ryan: I will say, going back to the sleep part and this whole idea of recovery, I don't think we said recovery, but really that's what it is to take that time.
When you set 150,000 miles a year, I never thought I'd say this, but I actually miss that. Like it's not [00:34:00] happening to that level. And the reason why I found since the. Uh, as we've gone through, it's like, I don't have that recovery time as much I'm meetings all day. Like there's none of that time to, and from the airport.
There's none of that time in the thing in the plane or, yeah, there's just no time or less time to recover. And I find myself getting really tired, uh, in the late in the later afternoons w when, at the time that matters most with my family.
Marquise Stillwell: Yep. And you know what the other thing is that is that we don't get as many impressions over and over again, to me, it's almost like back in the day when you computers would concoct make bike, you would have to go, you have to turn your computer off so that you can run through the system.
And for me sitting at her ratio park or sitting at, you know, you name it, uh, Madison square park and just relaxing sometimes. And just like having like in-between meetings is so refreshing because I feel like I'm [00:35:00] just watching dogs and life and all that, and I'm just kind of recovering. And that's what parks are for.
Right. And so, you know, you, you, you have the sound scape of water and a back that helps to balance out the hockey and horns and create some out of it. But if you go to Madison square park, it is a place of recovery and discovery. Right. And, and that to me is, would hospitality needs to borrow from right?
It's a similar intersection that big parks like that have. And what is it? What is it for me to be able to sit on a bench, feel safe, feel like I belong and be able to recover. Right. Yeah. And those are the places and it's simple. It's just a park, right? Some trees, some squirrels, ambient noise, noise. Right.
And I think less is more when it comes to hospitality and all the bells [00:36:00] and whistles of like you say, technology and, you know, smart TV and smart, this and that. All the extras that they think is necessary in a hotel. To me, it's, it's pretty simple. Give me good people who are paid well because they care about their job and they care about their job.
Um, a great lobby experience, some good food and a good place to sleep. Right. You can feel it. Yeah. That to me is the conditions for hospitality to go to the next level. So,
Dan Ryan: okay. We're, we've been through a pandemic we're in the middle of it. So aside from that, like, let's take the pandemic, let's put it in a, in a, in a ball and move it aside right now.
Yeah. What's keeping you up at night right now.
Marquise Stillwell: I mean, what's keeping me up right now. Um, you know, I do a lot of work in, um, sustainability and, you [00:37:00] know, the climate and climate change, and I think you were in Miami, we were in Miami to get, did you go to the ILC down in Miami? And, um, I was part of the panel around sustainability and the environment.
It's really great conversation. And you know, there's another hurricane tropical storm that's brewing right now. And as you know, as we speak and I'm really concerned about. Not only what it's going to do, um, for our coastline and for, you know, the, the world at large, but what is it going to do for our industry and what are we doing to plan for that?
Right. Um, the dirty word right now is always managed retreat. And what does that actually mean to actually just get out of the way and move, right? And so. Yeah, we'd need to start to have better conversations about, about that. You're going to see, um, climate gentrification, which is basically the movement of [00:38:00] one group of individuals into a nother neighborhood and moving those people out.
You're seeing that in little Haiti and places like that in Miami right now, because they're at the higher ground level than say Miami beach. And so all those wealthy individuals who are leaving the Miami beach area are moving inland and they're actually causing climate gentrification within certain neighborhoods.
Dan Ryan: That's another one I haven't heard you're full of them today. Climate gentrification. Yeah. So it's almost like an interest city refugee situation. Absolutely.
Marquise Stillwell: Absolutely. And then, you know, the reverse of that of course are the climate migrants who are having to leave because they are, they like what we're seeing in Portland, Oregon, right?
The fires. Um, you're already seeing people who are having deleted. Whole town has to leave and move, um, into mobile homes or motels, and almost permanently moved there [00:39:00] permanently to me is if you're there for more than one year, like your way out and your way to a new life has, has just been totally disrupted.
And so what is our role in that? Me as a designer, I think about that every day and in the, you know, as it pertains to the hospitality, I do believe that we need to play an important role when it comes to climate change, everything, to simplicity of plastics and you know, all those things that we can do on a day-to-day basis, all the way up to where we locate in the next hotel, where are we developing?
Because we're one of the biggest developers, you know, Um,
Dan Ryan: I've been seeing, I've talked about this a bunch, but we're sustainability about 10 years ago, it was, everyone was talking about it, then it kind of went away. Now it's really coming back. And I think the reason why it's coming back is it, it's not like climate change has gone anywhere.
It's still here. Right, right. But I feel like there's a follow the money kind of thing. And [00:40:00] I don't know what happened, but this whole idea of ESG investing, environmental, social governance,
all of the big investment firms and banks there, their investors and their customers are saying, well, this is important to us. So how can we show a measurable number that this is making a difference? And there's some interesting companies, like one is mine click, as it pertains to our industry in particular, that's doing some really cool jobs or some cool projects about it.
But I do feel that. There is this tip into here. I also, as we were talking about it, I think about, you know, to talk about that star Trek future. I was listening to this one interview with Neil deGrasse Tyson. Who's this astrophysicist from the museum of natural history. And he's great. He was, he was saying, look, if, if in the next 5,000, 500 years, I don't remember what the period was.
If we humans can't figure out how to be better to our earth and also geo engineer. So we can have some kind of a control over and he's like, [00:41:00] then I've, uh, I'm really upset and I I'm crestfallen. But, uh, he, like, if you really think of the human spirit and engineer it and focus, if we have an idea to do something, we've always proven
Marquise Stillwell: we can do it.
Absolutely. I mean, you look at the vaccine, you look at how quickly we were able to turn that. Um, regardless of what side of the divide you're, you're on, that is unbelievable that we could turn it that fast and get to a place where we are able to have a drug to help us get through this. Um, the, the challenge would climate change.
Isn't to me the argument of whether it's here or not, we know it's here. What we don't know right now is how fast it's going to hit us. Yeah. So it's the speed from which it's happening. And so, you know, we've, we, we're going to have another Sandy in New York area is to say, we don't know when, and we don't know how fast it's going to hit with that said, [00:42:00] we do have an opportunity to, to work every single day to get ahead of.
Because again, when it comes to our industry of what we do, it's about putting people at the center of service, making sure that people feel safe and make the belonged. And part of that is us also thinking beyond our singular industry and seeing the effects that we're having on everyone else. And I do believe that we'd need to elevate our responsibility when it comes to climate.
Dan Ryan: And also going back to that idea of proximity of luck, if hotels really are kind of, these cauldrons are crucibles where you can turn up the volume on proximity of luck and collisions and ideas and showing it in a great way. Like I think sh hotels has done a great job about that. It, it, it transcends into the minds of everyone there and it, it becomes part of everyone's zeitgeists and where we're going and how we're doing it.
And it helps us all be more
Marquise Stillwell: thoughtful. Yes, [00:43:00] absolutely. Absolutely. And I think that in doing that. I think to your, was it the star at night, the star Trek, future star Trek future. It will be a beautiful one.
Dan Ryan: I really hope so. I don't know when it comes or where, and I don't know if we have to rescue whales from a different galaxy at some point or however, but we're going to get there. So, but speaking of the future, the star Trek future is the one that excites me. Um, what's exciting. You most right now about the future?
You know,
Marquise Stillwell: one thing that I, I think is a real positive, that's come out of this moment, we're living in right now is the openness and willingness for people to collaborate. And I really feel that, that this idea of not only have we moved away from. Uh, need for office spaces, the way that we need office space, so that brick and mortar idea.
And I think it's going to come back, but I think it's going to be re-imagined in the nun. The future of [00:44:00] work is desk going to be more transitory, right? It's going to be going in now. And then you're going to kind of decide on how many days you go in how many days you're working from home. Because I certainly miss going into the offices, seeing people the same way that I enjoyed being able to do this.
And I think that that's what collaboration is going to look like. Um, not everyone's going to need to have just their own balance sheet and their own business, their own focus. I think that there's going to be ways for us to collaborate. And I think the future is, you know, these different types of joint ventures and collaborations that allow us to go into projects together, which is one thing that I really, really love about.
The work that we do, whether it's, you know, going after an RFP for an opportunity or, you know, collaborating with Curioso and, you know, Nina on the team won things. And so I've just been meeting so many people that are so much more open to collaborating, jumping on zoom, doing this, because I think we've [00:45:00] pulled down the laws of the brick and mortar.
So place where we understand that it's us, it's the people, it's not the office space. It's not the brick and mortar. It's not hanging your name up on the door. It's how do we connect to get things.
Dan Ryan: Especially for designers and creative people. It's not like you're, you're getting a, uh, a dose of inspiration between nine and five.
Marquise Stillwell: Right? When do
Dan Ryan: your best ideas come?
Marquise Stillwell: Yeah. Oh my goodness. Ah, yeah, for me, I love my mornings. I love when I can wake up early and I get my best contemplation. Um, and then I do get another quick kickstart, you know, say around nine or 10 o'clock sometimes. And, you know, there's moments where I'd go out in, you know, walk down to say Soho and have a drink or whatever, and just kind of meandered back up to our neighborhood.
And sometimes I would just sit and [00:46:00] I'd get on my phone or write something down. And it was just those, those in-between moments, right? It's the white space, right? It's the space in between the thing that is so much more powerful. And I love, and I miss the white space of contemplation because that's when my biggest ideas hopper
Dan Ryan: like tabula rasa or the clean ultimate creative space.
Yes. And then how do you and your team, like you do things for you and your team to kind of clear the deck so you can get to that creative space. Like how do you, how do you, yeah,
Marquise Stillwell: I think again, the other piece of the change that's happened is, um, checking in on mental health. And I think, you know, I, I just got off the phone a month ago with one of the directors.
And before we start into the, what of the conversation, it's, how are you feeling? You know, And [00:47:00] because of isolation, because of the things that we've all been through my hope and get, maybe it's a smaller group, but I'm hoping that there's a wider group of individuals who are recognizing mental health and the importance of actually checking in with your team and seeing how they're doing.
And that to me is how you create those conditions to be surprised because if they are allowed to be human, the right, right. The core of this conversation is putting people at the center, humans at the center of service. If people can actually be feeling. Then they will continue to serve at the next level is so for me, the team it's about creating those conditions that allow them to go human that allow them to fill a seed.
And then from there, once we set that intention, it starts to flow and I'm getting better at zoom. I'm definitely a person that struggled for a while because I like to see people and you know, their expressions and be in the room together. Um, but I think that I'm [00:48:00] getting a lot better at doing this. Um, and then I think it enhances when we do see each other in person, um, you know, when I was in Las Vegas and I got to see people I've only seen on zoom, it was like, Hey, what's happening?
And you know, it was just like next, next level. And so with our team, we've been able to set intentions around first recognizing. And making sure that they're okay. And I think in creating a safe space for open dialogue, it allows us to get to those creative juices,
Dan Ryan: um, on the feeling part and checking in, I went to this retreat and it, you know, working on empathy and all of this kind of cool stuff is really super deep work.
Uh, it's called the Hoffman process. It was really awesome.
Marquise Stillwell: Yeah. That's great. That was amazing. You jumped in
Dan Ryan: no, that's Wim Hoff. Oh yeah. I've, I've done Wim Hoff. This thing it's called the Hoffman process. I've jumped in the ice. I still take cold showers, but, um, on this, uh, [00:49:00] Hoffman process, what a cool thing.
And it was actually there. They wrote, uh, they had a write-up in the New York times and it's just checking in with your feelings. Like, what are your feelings? If someone says, oh, I'm fine. Or I'm good. That's. Right. So they have this whole sheet of feelings and it's like, I like with my family, I print printed out and I'm like, how are you feeling?
I'm good. No, no, no, no, give me a good one here. But when you really kind of push back on people and say, no, how are you really feeling? And then you're listening. It does so much more.
Marquise Stillwell: Yeah. I mean, that's how you get to the creative juices. And you know, that's why I really appreciate our friendship because men were horrible at doing this.
We're horrible at talking about feelings. And I appreciate, you know, having friends like you, that, you know, you're going to ask the question and I need to be able to give you the right answer. And to me, the answer is you have to deal with how people are feeling before you can talk about the creative process.
And sometimes we just want to skip to answer it. Oh, our creative process is that [00:50:00] we do this, this and this. I'm like, yeah. But how do you even get it? How do you even get your team to align around that?
Dan Ryan: And I think that ties back into that whole idea of, um,
Marquise Stillwell: service
Dan Ryan: and in order to truly serve, you have to truly hear and feel and see that's right.
You have to it's all of it. Um, it's just like, um, as you were saying to get to that restorative place of feeling at ease and relaxed in order to do it, you have to have, you have to tie in all of your sensitive.
Marquise Stillwell: Absolutely. And to me, what we're hearing in our space is that people who can't afford health insurance, who can't afford to feed them, they just want to matter like black lives matter.
You know, people want to matter. People want to be seen. And to me, what's going to save our industry and really get us to the next level is the way that we recognize people. And it's every person it's even the, you [00:51:00] know, the person who makes the front of. What is their story? Who are they? Right? I mean, the times that you go and travel, you spend with these individuals, right.
Is so important and, and the energy is an extension, right? And it goes all the way to that room where, I mean, I've, I mean, I know your work and I've stayed at places where I've seen your work. And I know the power of your ability to listen to every aspects of the clients that you're working with to get to a place where you've negotiated the full purpose of the integrity of the work.
Dan Ryan: And, uh, and it's also in order for that to happen through the whole process of no matter what widget you're doing, it's you have to listen to the vision and tap into that vision to have a clear vision, um, marquees, what are some really awesome projects that you're working on? It doesn't have to be in hospitality.
It could be anything out there like what's, what's getting you super jazzed right now. [00:52:00]
Marquise Stillwell: What we're working on a number of projects. And so. On the open box side. What I'm excited about are some of the larger master planning projects that we're working on that allows us to go deeper with communities, um, acknowledging who they are, acknowledging their footprint within this space.
That's being redeveloped. Um, development doesn't need to be a dirty four letter word. Um, it can be very inclusive. Um, I think one key lesson for anyone that's listening that may be an architect or developer it's saved your renderings for the third date. Right. And so you just talked about listening when you bring renderings and it automatically says that you're pretty much ahead of the game.
And why are you asking me these questions? And it's really important because a lot of times I always say, are you listening or are you waiting to be heard. Right. And that's really, [00:53:00] really important for the work that we do. Are you listening or are you just waiting to be heard? And when you come in with renderings, um, on the first date, um, you're not there to listen.
You're just there to be heard. And so the work that we're doing right now is allowing us to break. And go wider. And so we're doing some great master planning work in a couple of different cities. Um, you know, we just finished the, the Bauhaus film, um, with the open docs, which was really exciting and fun.
So the story of Moholy nausea is the story basically when the Bauhaus left Germany and went to Chicago to, to eventually formed the Institute of design. And it was a really fun process for me, particularly a person of color, um, going to Germany and spending a lot of time at the original Bauhaus and, and seeing and uncovering what was there and being able to go through the archives and being able to also present.
Um, you know, [00:54:00] my whole, the story, um, to those that may not have heard the full story of what he did in Chicago. Um, and I was really excited and proud to be able to do that type of work. Um, and I'm, you know, a big Bauhaus learned. So I love loved being able to do that, um, type of work. So those are a few other projects that, that we just finished or we're working on right now.
Cool.
Dan Ryan: Um, I wrote down save renderings for the third date. Yes. I couldn't agree with you more. And I actually, I have an episode coming up. I interviewed, uh, Christian gr Dano. Who's the CEO of Manzini Duffy, their architecture design firm in New York city. He's great. But he said something really super cool.
Where, when they're doing renderings or presenting their, their schematics in the design development process. Yeah. They [00:55:00] put the price tag on the different architectural elements. So they'll have this beautiful rendering and then different options with the number there, which it sounds really weird. But instead of doing this, as they're doing it, someone else is watching the reaction of the clients and listening to that feedback and be like, okay, well now we know that we're not going that direction.
Or now we know that this is so important, we'll spare no expense and have this direction. And I think if you can, wow, let's try to go. And yeah, that transparency and saving that vision for the third date and having it all there and continuing that transparency, I think that's like super powerful, um, clarity
Marquise Stillwell: for everyone.
Yes. Yes, it is. The development process is a, it's a people. And sometimes we think that it's just a process of, of moving things and come up with ideas and it's not, it's emotional and we need to respect people. And because [00:56:00] ultimately we are building for people, not just building for buildings
Dan Ryan: and we have two of these and one of these,
Marquise Stillwell: right, exactly.
Two to one ratio. And
Dan Ryan: so often we don't do that. And I mean, I I'm guilty of it as well. And I got to really check myself often to make sure that I'm doing this and not this. Uh, so marquees, let's go back to the younger version of you at the Ramada, doing folding towels, driving the bus, checking people in getting people's bags, like doing the whole thing.
You now approach yourself the younger version of yourself. What advice do you give yourself?
Marquise Stillwell: Slow down. It's going to happen. That's what I say to anyone that I'm mentoring and, you know, I love mentoring and I'm constantly telling them when I, when you hear from me, it's me telling my younger self is to slow down, it's going to happen.
Right? [00:57:00] And these ideas, the ideas of create the conditions to be surprised, meet the right people, follow through on the simple things, enjoy your life. Like I, I was so serious and get on like constantly doing things, you know, in my younger. So, and I'm glad I did those things. Um, I, I wish I would have slowed down more, um, and, and enjoyed the journey.
And now I'm at a place where I get what it means to enjoy.
Dan Ryan: Yeah, I love that journey, but also in slowing down, I'm curious to see, okay, I get the slowing down and being more present and mindful, but at the, but not at the expense of increasing or being around that proximity of luck and that density of network, like, how do you [00:58:00] balance those?
Marquise Stillwell: It is for me when I look back, um, I did a really good job of meeting a lot of different people and doing things, but I don't think, and again, like it's always 20, 20, right? When we look back and I don't think that in your twenties, you're able to go deep so I can go across, but it takes a certain age to go deeper.
Life is about asking better questions, not answer. Right. Who cares about answers is can you ask the better question you and I, our relationship is based on the fact that we're good at asking questions and each time that we've met, our relationship has gotten stronger because we asked better questions.
It wasn't because you and I had the answers, but that takes us a certain level of maturity that someone in their twenties was no way they're going to get that confidence. Even if they're listening to you. And I talk right now, they're like, what are they [00:59:00] talking about? Right. And so, again, my advice to my younger self, it's almost new because it couldn't even be done because when I say slow down, it's slowed down and find depth.
Right. And that's what I wish I could have known how to do it.
Dan Ryan: Yeah. And the thing that I appreciate, and I'm grateful with you and our friendship is just in asking those questions. There is a certain. Trust and comfort that, Hey, you know what, I might ask the wrong question, but at least hear me and give me, give me some gentle feedback of like, Hey, this is let's navigate this, this heavy issue.
Marquise Stillwell: Yeah, yeah, no. And it's like, you know, the advice that you gave when it came to, you know, the employees, um, like the feedback, uh, but it's the book that you gave us traction trach. Yes. [01:00:00] Yes. It was great. It was great, you know, and the sharing and the back and forth, um, with books in insight, in, you know, with your unit, you've asked me about my assistant and chief of staff and like each time.
It's like we're entrepreneurs and people don't understand how lonely it is to be an entrepreneur. Right? You don't have any colleagues. Um, no one at your office is ever going to tell you the full truth. No one, no matter how much you think your buddies and you drank, you know, path one and laugh. They're never going to tell you the truth of everything, right?
And so you need other entrepreneurs to actually hang out with and talk to that you can trust and that you can bounce things off of openly because at the end of the day, critique is a gift. Feedback is again, Um, and the ability to provide feedback for each other. You know, even if it's just like you and I at the corner of 21st and seventh, and [01:01:00] just hanging out there for a quick moment, because we passed each other as we're going separate ways, those quick moments where the proximity of.
Of getting me to this place where I'm, you know, in the industry, having conversations with people like Larry and others, and you have been very instrumental in helping to create that. And I really appreciate that. And that's what I mean by my younger self, I would say slow down and find depth because it's been in a depth that has actually allowed me to scale to new Heights.
Dan Ryan: Well, you're making me blush, first of all, second of all. Uh, yeah, it's on my someday maybe list. I will have a chief of staff someday because I just think that that is such an important role. And I, it, it elevates that of an assistant to a chief of staff, which is just incredible. I mean, it's, it's so much more and it, it just, it helps increase that proximity of luck because you're in [01:02:00] your zone of genius.
Yes. Yes. You're having those connections.
Marquise Stillwell: Yeah. Yeah. It's so nuts. You know, when we talk about finding that moment of creativity through contemplation, it's having someone like a chief of staff that, that, you know, certain things are going to be taken care of because we're entrepreneurial, we're, we're daydream.
Like I need to work 12 to 15 months ahead of the team. I'm always in month, like now to six months and I never get the vision past the year. We're in trouble, we're in big trouble because you know, 12 to 15 months goes fast.
Dan Ryan: Oh, it's a blink of an eye. And, uh, yeah. And it's really important to really stay in that vision because if you have your vision, which I know you have, everyone else can be in alignment with you and you're, you're, you're changing the world.
We're all changing the world in our own way. But it's all about having that. Yeah. It's that [01:03:00] inspiration. Yeah, exactly.
Marquise Stillwell: I mean, you're what you do everyday is inspire your staff. That's what I do. And I need to be a head to that, that vision. I keep need to keep pushing it out 12, 24 months, what we're going to do in the next three years, meeting with people like yourself and others and hearing the exciting new things that are coming down the pipeline.
Right. And then integrating some of those pieces into the day to day, but then growing and growing and stretching my team. But I can't do that if I don't have this space.
Dan Ryan: Yeah. And, and again, it's that clean white space. That creative
Marquise Stillwell: space. Yeah. We need that. Cool.
Dan Ryan: Um, well, marquees, I, as I said, like, I'm just grateful that we're friends at you, you inspire me and I'm just excited for you on your journey into this industry and your continued journey into this industry.
And if people are looking for you, how can they connect with you and your. Yeah.
Marquise Stillwell: I mean, they can go to open box website, [01:04:00] N B x.com. I'm also on LinkedIn. Now. I'm always open to connecting with people on that and, um, yeah, they can always reach out. Um, we have a hello at open box email as well. Um, but I'm pretty, if you just quickly Google me or Google us here, it's pretty easy to find.
And then what they can just hit you up there. Cause he knew exactly how
Dan Ryan: to reach me. I know where to find you
Marquise Stillwell: Zachary. So, but, um, I I've really enjoyed this conference. I mean always enjoy our talks and conversations and I always learn so much from you. And again, I just want to say thank you for helping to, to, you know, bring me into this industry in a more meaningful way at, at a way of death and your network is that's amazing and I've really appreciate and respect that.
And um, you know, the way that you answer emails and text messages and the way that we're able to go back and [01:05:00] forth, I'm really appreciate, um, you know, the integrity that you have. With, with your work. So thank you. Well, now
Dan Ryan: I've got, I've gone from blushing to tearing up now. Marquees. Thank you seriously.
I'm so grateful to call you a friend and thank you.
Marquise Stillwell: Absolutely no problem.
Dan Ryan: And thank you to everyone listening. And I, again, I hope this talk evolves your view on how to deliver hospitality and what hospitality means, because there's not a specific definition. It's this whole nebulous idea and feeling and empathy.
And if this has changed your journey or your perspective, please share the podcast with others. Thank you everyone. Thank you, Marcie. Goodbye. That was awesome.
Marquise Stillwell: Yay.