Defining Hospitality

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Dan Ryan: Today's guest is highly skilled at space planning. He fosters excellence within a design team. He uses a client's creativity, focus and experience to turn their dream into reality. He is an associate principal at Tru X Collins, architecture and design in Burlington, Vermont. Recently they won the HD award for best event space at the Omni Bretton woods, ski ski facility, ladies and gentlemen, mark Des Smith.
Welcome mark. Thank you, Dan.
Marc DeSmet: It's so good to see you. Yeah, it's great to catch up and it's great to be part of, [00:01:00] uh, Part of your little niche of the, uh, of the industry here. I feel like you, like every time I see you, I'm learning more about our diaspora of the hospitality design culture.
Dan Ryan: Yeah. Well, and that's, that's a great, uh, starting point because I think I first met you in New York city.
Um, you were working at Jeffrey beers up on 20th street, uh, and fifth avenue. And I remember up there in that great office they've since moved down to. Wherever the freedom tower. Yeah. And in a way, since you moved up to Vermont, , I must let everyone know. I'm like, I was secretly jealous because, and I, and I resented you that you could move up to like one of my favorite states in the union, uh, you know, just from all the outdoor stuff that I love doing.
Um, and also music that I like, which we can talk about later. Yeah. Um, I don't want to embarrass myself right in the beginning of the conversation.
I know so many other friends in O in other businesses, not necessarily in what we do [00:02:00] that have all moved to Vermont or all moved to Utah or all moved to like a place where quality of life. Yes. Is just different. And some may argue is more incredible.
Marc DeSmet: certainly we, we do what's best for, for, um, For ourselves and, and our families. But, uh, for me, it was, um, it was a little bit of both. It was, uh, it was stretching my legs, uh, figuratively and literally as go hiking and everything else, but also about family, which is, uh, is an important thing too. Uh, I moved my parents here.
I'm here. I have brother and sister-in-law here and my niece as well. So it's. You know, and it was pre COVID. Like a lot of people have kind of circled wagons through the process of experiencing COVID. But luckily I started this process before that
Dan Ryan: hit . Oh yeah. That's also very important to add. It was well before COVID so, and now you're there, [00:03:00] uh, you're sprouting roots or you've S roots.
Now you're growing like a substantial tree, I would say and. I don't know. I, and I keep seeing all this great success and, and just really cool projects. And so tell me about like that evolution from city to country and like how you may have evolved and like, You know how your perspective has changed?
Marc DeSmet: Yeah, it, it was, it was a little nervewracking at first. I mean the, the, uh, New York lifestyle and, uh, it's hard to come off of that adrenaline, uh, of being in New York and certainly working with Jeffrey. Uh, provided some of that adrenaline, as you remember, from our old office. Yeah. Um, but having moved up here and kind of settled in with this, uh, great team at true X Collins and having spent the last 10 years here and really kind of, um, working with, uh, the team here, which we at truck colon has already had a [00:04:00] hospitality design.
Market going, but being able to come that come in, bring a different perspective and learn from their perspective was huge about getting to know local craftsmen, getting to know personally the woodworker, getting to know the guy that has a tilt up barn and his backyard, and does his own metal work, uh, It brought a different, um, perspective to the design process.
And, um, and I can't say that I'll ever look back really because I can do this and I can fly down to New York city without a layover and be right back in it and be, have a meeting with you and have a meeting with other people in the industry that are as avid about building and making and participating.
Thing we call hospitality, um, every, every bit as [00:05:00] much.
Dan Ryan: Were you, were you at the platinum circle awards this past October? It was platinum circle. I think it was platinum circle, platinum circle. In New York?
No,
Marc DeSmet: uh, no last October, no.
Dan Ryan: Okay. So what's interesting is, as you're talking about all the craftsmanship, um, Larry Traxler from Hilton was honored.
Yeah. And he talked about his experience working at Jordan Moser in Chicago and what was really unique and interesting about them and where he started his career. Yeah is they would make everything, they would design it and then they would make it, they would do castings. They would do the, the, the metal work.
I, I don't everything. So they really got like, and, and it, when you say the word diaspora, there was him and a whole bunch of other people from that little nest that kind of went off to do these great things and. So I kind of wanna pull on that thread of you going up there as a already successful designer.
Okay. So much in the same way that you know, you're getting [00:06:00] into a new level of detail and how you look at design yes. From, and, and learning from the craftsman around you. Um, The transition from, you know, Chelsea mm-hmm, flat iron, New York city.
Yeah. Up to Vermont. Um, as far as just like the pace, like how do you think the pace has changed? How you look at your design process?
Marc DeSmet: Oh, uh, dramatically. So, um, the pace of the pace of our industry is fast, but I have the created the space in moving up here. And my, and my, and, and quality of life is a, is a hallmark of our firm.
And, um, and we want, uh, we work very hard to create that, um, for them as well. That you have the mind space to be creative, that you don't feel like you [00:07:00] have to rush through every decision because something has to be on a boat tomorrow from, uh, you know, wherever it's coming from. And it just, it it's a healthier creativity to me and, you know, that's gonna be different for everybody, but for me, and, and I think, uh, the, those that, um, I work with, I think it's true for them as well.
Um, is there some pinch points and is there that adrenaline rush of trying to deliver a. That number goes away, but the, where I see it is really on the front end with when that design process starts. We can give ourselves a little, I feel, I feel like we can give ourselves a little bit more space. We invite, we often invite our clients up to our office space and our office space is right on lake Champlain.
Our conference room looks right out on the lake. It's it's about that sense of place. And [00:08:00] then they can maybe relax a little bit too, and we can have a real honest conversation about what their goals are, how the design's taking shape. It doesn't feel as rushed as, oh, I've gotta be downstairs. My Uber's almost here, you know?
Dan Ryan: Yeah. And, and you don't have that weird New York city, uh, Police siren or whatever it is that like, I still don't. I still don't understand how they figured out that sound, but yeah. It's like, I appreciate that. And I think what's resonating me the most, um, in, in how you said that was this idea of, of healthier creativity.
Yeah. Right. So, okay. So now we've talked about. Designing and details, changing from a shifting to more of a craftsman type idea. There's this healthier creativity where you have more space. I, I just get the sense that you're breathing deeper and able to be a [00:09:00] more centered creative being. Yeah. And then as you look at for the accolades that you won, that I mentioned in the beginning and the projects that you're winning, like within hospitality, how is that?
Changing how you address what hospitality means.
Marc DeSmet: Uh, the, um, well, a lot of times we think of hospitality as, uh, it's a, you know, you look it up in the dictionary, hospitality's a noun. It's a thing. It's, it's that gift package on the credenza. When you get to your room, it's, uh, it's the match books on the host stand, you know, There's never any more of, but the it's those, you know, we think of hospitality as things.
I, I don't, I don't think, and I don't think of it as a thing anymore. I think of, it's not a noun. Hospitality is a verb. It's an action of greeting. It's an action of welcoming [00:10:00] It has a timeframe to it. It has moving parts. It has participants in it. So for me, uh, hospitality, I'll use a simple example that, um, That refreshing drink you get when you arrive at the resort mm-hmm right.
You know, the, the waiters there with, uh, a bunch of cold drinks or whatever, that's hospitality, but is hospitality the drink? Is it a thing or is it the action? Of being greeted upon your arrival of receiving the drink. It's hospitality is a verb mm-hmm it needs to be given and received. It's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's an action, not a static thing.
Um, With that in mind, it, it's not, you know, some, some, uh, some of those actions are a FMO [00:11:00] they're momentary. Some of them are enduring. They, you know, you went on vacation, you had this, unforgettable vacation. Well, it's unforgettable. That's a memory that's gonna stay with you. It's gonna influence your life.
So, um, so for me, and, uh, the way we design and maybe this has something to do with what we were talking about of ha giving ourselves space to design is that that hospitality is about creating positive. It's an interchange. It's a play between people, a play between the space and a person. And it's about, it's about memory.
It's about creating positive memories if you do it right. And, um, much in the way I think, uh, you know, we say hospitality spaces is about stage set. We're creating a backdrop for those. memories And to me, that's, that's what
Dan Ryan: hospitality is. I, I love that the backdrop for those memories, I'm writing that [00:12:00] down because all right.
So in, in, in, okay, so thinking about this as a verb, creating this backdrop. Then your transformation as a human over the past 10 years, a human, a designer, a son, a parent of a husband, like, um, how do you think if, if you go before from moving from New York to Vermont, let's just say, and then you go, uh, where did, where did you go to, um, School for architecture.
Marc DeSmet: I studied architecture at, uh, university Detroit mercy in Detroit, Michigan.
Dan Ryan: And are you, are you from Michigan as well? I
Marc DeSmet: am from Michigan. I grew up out right outside of Detroit. Uh, and, uh, my partner's from Detroit. Um, it's, uh, I wear Detroit t-shirts every weekend. great. The whole thing I'm that?
Dan Ryan: God . [00:13:00] Okay.
So like, okay, so you're in Detroit. You're thinking about, okay. How, how do I start these steps onto my career path? So much as the, as the same way that you enjoy that, that transition? So Vermont and the country and the, that kind of healthier creativity. What drove you to New York city? What drove you to the crucible?
Marc DeSmet: um, that, uh, that's a little historic. That's great. Um, well right outta school, my first pro, like it it's all been reductive. And, and, and give me a moment to explain, but it's all kind of condensed and condensed that, uh, right outta school. My first project outta school was working on, uh, Ford field for a firm called Rosetti associates.
And we were designing. A sports stadium. I mean, it doesn't get any bigger in terms of hospitality than that. How, how do you, how are you hospitable [00:14:00] to, uh, a 70,000 seat arena, you know, and it started there. And then, uh, from there I went to work for a little firm that was doing shopping malls, like, you know, million square feet or more.
And, um, and they also had a little group in the back that did restaurants. And I was like, oh, what are those guys doing in the back? Okay, I'll start doing restaurants. Well, it just so happens that a guy that used to work for them worked in New York city. And I'm like, oh, maybe I could go work in New York city and see even more of this restaurant design stuff, because this was so interesting.
Uh, it didn't hurt that. I had a girlfriend that moved to New York and, you know, typical New York story that you chase the girl to New York, but it doesn't work out and you stay anyway.
Dan Ryan: Then they, then new York's got its hooks in. So then New
Marc DeSmet: York has its hooks in you. And at that point I was working for Rockwell group, um, under the [00:15:00] tutelage of David Mexico.
And, um, and he, uh, he was, he was from Detroit as well, so it kind of closed that loop. And so he got his hooks in me, New York got its hooks in me. And, and then from there it was on with Jeffrey beers, one of, uh, one of my mentors and then. And then it just started to balloon from there. And, um, but the desire, um, the desire was always to find the joy and the details.
You know, people will, architects will always quote, you know, God is in the details. Well, for me, it was like trying to finesse those details and make those things you touch. You know what the design is about. So
Dan Ryan: on the detail thing, God is in the, was that Meese Vander row or was that Louis Kahn?
Marc DeSmet: Um, I've heard it credited to Meese.
Okay.
Dan Ryan: But
Marc DeSmet: I've [00:16:00] also seen that that's wrong and that it was supposed to be Louis K. So I think we need to ask a historian on who was actually. Much, like I've heard, you know, I've heard it quoted that Morris LaPas said too much is never enough, but I think people will argue that he actually said that or not.
So it's well
Dan Ryan: then it, as we're quoting architects, my favorite one is, um, Philip Johnson, who said all architects are horrors. Yeah. Well,
Marc DeSmet: I don't know if I want, I don't know if I want to admit that
Dan Ryan: uh, that was a funny one. Um, okay. So. New York city learning about details, creating these memorable spaces of events.
Um, yeah. And then I assume from just your experience from the Rockwell world, and then also the Jeffrey BES beers world, there's just, those spaces are just so incredible and memorable and like there's a lot of [00:17:00] light and music and a thing, right. It's like, it's like you're creating, um, I don't know. How would you, how would you describe the, the types of projects and the things that you were working on?
And then again there, which now as you're in this kind of healthier creativity, creative space, like, how do you, how do you contrast those? And like, what did you learn? What was the, the most impactful thing you learned from working at Rockwell and Jeffrey beers? And then like, then you have this space and now you're taking, I don't know, we all stand on the shoulders of those before us.
And I believe in. What were the biggest, um, learnings that from those two firms as you, then you made your way up north? Oh, uh, uh,
Marc DeSmet: I think everything you touched on is, is, is relevant. The music, the light, the, uh, certainly. Learning about light has carried through this whole thing and, and all those things.
But for, [00:18:00] and I think David, I, I think David and and Jeffrey would both agree that there's a certain amount of spectacle. Mm-hmm that went into this, um, that went into hospitality design. And has, has transitioned and evolved and, and changed. And for me in particular, I got out of New York so that I could focus on slowing it down, slowing it down and getting much more contemplative about it, where, um, Yes, we still need sparkle.
Yes. We still need music. Yes. We still need all these things, but let's not throw everything at the wall. Let's be more edit. Let's be better editors. Mm-hmm and that's kind of where I think this, this space to design helps with that process. We can be better editors. We can say. Um, um, you [00:19:00] know, what is. What is it that makes this space so specific to this location, to this guest profile, to this, you know, and we can really analyze it and we don't have to make any assumptions.
And we don't have to say, well, they'll love it, cuz I love it. Um, you know, in a Steve jobs sort of way but. It's getting down to that nitty gritty and really being able to think of it that way. And it's a different guest profile. It's not about, um, for us and what we do up here. It's not these, you know, 250 room, 500 room hotels anymore.
You know, we do 50 room hotels. We do a hundred room hotels. I think our biggest hotel was 200 rooms and that was at the cliff house in, uh, in a gunk, Maine. And, um, And that's, and that's the biggest. Yeah. Uh, and, and still very boutique in that property, but we're, we're narrowing it down even more like, [00:20:00] like let's give we're, we're working with, um, clients that really want to give a very, uh, specific experience and it tends to be very, um, Location specific, uh, service level specific.
Um, one of our wonderful clients is, uh, uh, the twin farms property up here in Southern Vermont. And they've got 20 rooms right
Dan Ryan: now. I mean, they're really amazing. And, um, yeah, I really love what they've done and yeah, that's a fantastic project.
Marc DeSmet: And, and, and I think having the space to design as we were talking about earlier, having that head space is what makes that kind of property.
Possible you can't rush that kind of thing. Uh, which isn't to say that, uh, you can't do that with a hundred rooms. I think you can, it's [00:21:00] scalable, but there's a threshold. There's a point where, um, the guest becomes commodity and not guest anymore. Mm-hmm and, uh, that's not really our thing. Mm-hmm um, and I think, um, I think that there's a, a danger in the industry to, to lose sight of, of that, of the giving, the guests, that personal experience, you know, we're talking about what, what defines hospitality.
I think it has to be a personalized experience and you have to make those personal memories and those personal connections. What, what better? Um, Um, what, what better, uh, payback from the guests to the, to the hotel air is to have the guests go away with a memory that he tells 20 of his friends about. And then 20 of them want to go experience that thing too, or they want to take their kids there every year because, [00:22:00] uh, it was an incredible thing and it becomes a family tradition.
You know, it, what, I can't think of a better credit to our design process. Then, if we can create a space that has a
Dan Ryan: legacy, I love the idea of payback because, or pay payback specifically of creating a memory. Mm-hmm because. I, I think in everything that all of us do and there's a certain, and obviously this goes through hospitality, but it's really in, in every kind of vocation, I think we should all strive and aspire to create a Legion of raving fans.
right. Because, because if we've done our best work. They're gonna go tell their friends and those friends are gonna tell their friends and it becomes this self-fulfilling, um, kind of fly flywheel of success. Yeah. Um, so specifically on that front, like the memory, I, I just love that the [00:23:00] memory payback payback with memory.
Yeah. Payback with creation of memories. Like what's a, a project in your 10 years. Since you've been with, uh, Truex Collins, what's a project or a part of a project that you think really, um, encapsulates that, where you've gotten, where you've created those raving fans or they, or the best feedback you've gotten.
Like, can you share any of that with us?
Marc DeSmet: Uh, I mean, there's, um, There's there's little things that pop up and then there's bigger things. So the little things are the phone call you get like, oh, I love that wallpaper. You got like, I just stayed at hotel Jackson. In, uh, Jackson, Wyoming. And I asked the general manager who designed it and they said, you and they gave me your card.
And, and I just wanna know, where did you find that incredible drapery, right? Like, it's it, it's such a little thing, right? Yeah. But this. This per when we get [00:24:00] that phone call it's so in earnest. Yeah. There's like that person is just dying to know. And then, um, there's other things that are like, um, you'll be scrolling through Instagram and you'll see somebody that took a picture of a family vacation and it's right there in the, in the lobby at, at, um, At the Omni Mount Washington, or, you know, right at the, at the bar that we recently completed at the, at the same, at the same time we were doing that lodge.
And you're like, that's a compliment. Mm-hmm that? I've now I'm now part of that person's family album. In this very way that they'll never know. And they'll, you know, the kids will not, it doesn't matter. It you're you created that opportunity. I wonder what they talked about while they sat at that bar. I wonder what story they shared.
I wonder what story they're gonna tell somebody [00:25:00] about sitting at that bar, all these things like. I don't know. I, I, I don't, I, I don't have need to have my name and their family album to know that I'm creating something that pays dividends for them. Yeah. Uh, they, they, you know, and maybe, you know, somebody would say, oh, it's Instagram.
It's, it's completely ephemeral. It's gone in 10 seconds. But for the Pearson that took the picture, it probably isn't. Yeah.
Dan Ryan: Well, okay. So, and that's the double edged sword of social media, right? Mm-hmm okay. It's ephemeral. But some, it impacted somewhat enough that they wanted to share that. And yeah, I bet.
And, and that's a part of their, it's a part of their life story and their family memory. And I think that's a real power, like in all these conversations that I, I have with everyone, I think, um, especially with the designers and the architects that the designers and creators, um, it's just like, it's like, it's, it's, um, humbling it that, to be able to sh [00:26:00] speak to people that have the ability.
And the talent to do that. Um, but it's really like, you become these kind of sta uh, timestamps in people's yeah. Personal histories.
Marc DeSmet: Yeah. You're, you're, uh, you know, the things that, uh, we make, um, and I'm guilty of this too. Like, I I'll I'll. Completely not in my, um, in my, um, portfolio, all, all memories. I created other people's projects.
I'll use Detroit as an example, cuz obviously I go back to Detroit. I love Detroit as, um, uh, stated the foundation hotel. Mm-hmm. And I love that hotel. I didn't get to design that hotel. I wish I could have, but , um, but you know, amazing experience there. And I've had three meals in the, um, in their, at the, uh, well at the bar and at their [00:27:00] restaurant and I've stayed the night there and the whole deal.
And. It is a picture in my head. I picture my friends sitting at that bar with me when I went home to visit my high school friends that I hadn't seen in 10 years. And we got together there and that bar becomes a picture in my head. It is the stage set of my reunion with them. Yeah. What I, I aspire that every day when I pick up a pencil and draw, I wanna create something that does
Dan Ryan: that.
That is a great property. I actually had the pleasure of working on that one and providing the furniture there. Um, With semi deer. And I remember I did these tables. There was the first tables I ever sourced from Mexico. And they were just kind of like these long, like tree trunks that were just, um, sliced into big chunks, waterfall edge.
And so many people take pictures of those and it's in such a great space. Yeah. And it's just really, it's really, really cool to [00:28:00] see. Um, that's a really awesome property. Um, so pulling on the Detroit thing. So when I, when I hear Detroit and. I think about like our conversations of music and I look at your, your LinkedIn profile and there's like knobs of an amp.
And I think of kiss and like Detroit rock city, and I'll stick out my gene Simmons tongue. Um, I'm not gonna do that, uh, because his is amazing. Um, like how, and you've mentioned music a few times in this conversation, like how, how. Why are there knobs of a amp on your LinkedIn profile? You're a designer.
You're an architect. Like why do you have amp knobs on your LinkedIn profile?
Marc DeSmet: because, um, for me it, it's, it's probably a, it's symbolic in a couple ways for one, I want to, if, um, If a [00:29:00] potential client or a potential collaborator or whoever it is, looks at my profile and they see that little graphic and music means something to them.
Great. Mention it let's have that conversation. Let's, let's start that as our common language also. It's a little bit symbolic in the idea that, oh, let's turn up the volume a little bit. Let's take things a little bit further than we thought we were going to two 11. Yeah, exactly. I
Dan Ryan: okay. I love that. Have I?
I ever told you my gene Simmons story
Marc DeSmet: you're no. Tell me your
Dan Ryan: gene Simmons story. Oh my God. Okay. So I, I don't know if, okay. So I was on an airplane from LA to Vegas. It was when I was living in LA. I had, like, I was really hungry and I stopped and I got like a 20 piece chicken McNugget. I'm sorry, everyone.
I, I like chicken McNuggets. Um, and I was sitting, I got upgraded. Thank goodness. So I was sitting in first class on an aisle and Jean Simmons was sitting right next to me. And he's like, Hey, [00:30:00] those smell great. Can I have one, can I have one? I was like, sure. So we shared chicken McNuggets. I don't remember why I was going to Vegas, but literally two weeks later, um, I was still living in Los Angeles at the time.
And, uh, my wife and I were visiting New York. It was before we lived there. So it must have been like 2003, four, and we were staying at the RGA Royal, which I think is now the London. I actually don't know what it is now, but it's on 54th there and we were out with friends. It was like three in the morning.
We were waiting in the elevator lobby. Yeah. To go up. And, um, in walks, Jean Simmons with two like beautiful blonde women, one in each arm. And I was like, Jean. How are you? And he's like, Hey, like thinking I was just like a fan, which I, which I am. But then I was like, no, it's me, Dan. We shared chicken McNuggets the other day.
He's like, oh my God, how are you? . And, and then he walks past this and he goes, I was like, I don't. I'm great. [00:31:00] Uh, yeah. How are you? And as he walks into the elevator with these two women, The doors start closing. He is like another day above ground and then he just the doors close and he goes up to his room.
wow. Oh my God. And that was, uh, that was great cheese Simmons story. Yeah. Chicken McNuggets, chicken McNuggets,
Marc DeSmet: and another day above ground and another day above ground. Um,
Dan Ryan: okay, so then another thing I wanna pull on that music thing some more, um, yeah. As you know, I've talked to you a lot. Yeah. And actually last night I was just wa rewatching, um, the July 16th Bangor main show by Phish.
Yeah. And Phish from Burlington, my favorite band ever. I know some people that I know, some people that were at that show, oh my God, they did a 30 minute down with disease. It was freaking crazy. I tried to watch it with my kids this morning. They didn't want anything to do with it. but it was 30 minutes and it was amazing.
And they. [00:32:00] In Burlington or maybe they have houses some live, but I feel like you may have switched places with Trey because he spends most of his time in the upper west side. Right. And now you're up there in, uh, in Burlington, like. have you experienced them? Like, are they around town? Like, what's that all about?
I mean, this is my fanboy asking the questions
Marc DeSmet: to satisfy your fanboy, Dan . Um, they are around town. You don't see them very often. Mm-hmm um, but they're here and, and lo locals don't really. Call 'em out on it, you know, the, the nod or whatever, but, um, but they're around. Um, we did, um, we helped, uh, we helped Mike Gordon with some furniture selections once, but I won't go too much into that because then you'll start asking me questions.
I can't
Dan Ryan: answer. I will not ask you any questions you [00:33:00] can't answer.
Marc DeSmet: Where did you deliver them to. Oh, I won't, I don't,
Dan Ryan: I, I hope I don't need to know any of that. I just need to know that they, that they have a presence near you and in some way you're feeding off them because I feed off them all the time.
Yeah,
Marc DeSmet: no, I think it's, um, And, you know, to some people it's, uh, Phish is, um, Phish is a religion, um, to, to others of us. It's a mood. Yeah. I think, I think I fall into the I'm. I'm not as, as deep into the fish as you are, but, uh, certainly. Whenever I go by, uh, nectars, which they is, where they got their start.
Nectar is still there and, and run. And I, I pointed out to my friends who are visiting Burlington. I say, yeah, that's nectars. That's where Phish got started. But, um, I think for a lot of us, I mean, we've got music is part of our culture up here,
Dan Ryan: music, beer, and [00:34:00] syrup.
Marc DeSmet: Yeah, well, uh, yeah, and, and, uh, and many people would add skiing or boarding to that as well.
That's true. Um, I gave, I gave up the ski and my back can't quite handle it anymore, but, uh, um, but music is definitely part of it and whether it's, um, whether it's fish, uh, whether it's, um, I'm trying to think of a name that will pop for you. Um, oh, now of course it doesn't come to mind. no, don't worry about, yeah,
Dan Ryan: got it.
Uh, I just, I, again, from the times that I've been in Burlington and like looking out over, uh, lake Champlain and I just feel like there's all, especially in the, well, in the winter, like around on there, it's ski, I'm not really hanging out, but in the times, in the summer when I've been there, I don't know, I just get this super positive vibe.
Uh, and there's usually just a lot of [00:35:00] smiles. Mm-hmm, a lot of music and a lot of beer and it's just like, it's just like this cool thing going on. I, I love it. Yeah.
Marc DeSmet: Yeah. And I, and I think, um, I, I think that, that, uh, the quality of life thing is, is huge. And I think we pay benefits. Um, Uh, from a, as a business that way mm-hmm because we can, we think a little bit differently than, than we would if we were living in the city and it, we can provide a, a difference that way.
And it certainly, um, makes it a lot easier for me, uh, to be able to do what I love doing. Well being in a place that facilitates that. And, uh, and well, I
Dan Ryan: can tell you, I, I ki I took a, a half ass step from New York, so now I'm in Connecticut. So I'm, I'm in new England now I'm in new England. Uh,
Marc DeSmet: we're going, we're gonna get you up.
keep going further north.
Dan Ryan: I think that, I think that's the answer. And then, uh, I can go. [00:36:00] The Theon trap family up there in snow in St. Yeah, because I also have a big Austrian connection actually going to Austria soon to go see family, but we always have the, yeah. The sound of music playing. And again, the Hills are alive with the sound of music they are, they are
Marc DeSmet: very much so I had, I hadn't even thought to take our musical story all the way back to the singing family, RO uh, V.
But that's a great reference too.
Dan Ryan: love it. So, yeah. And now I do want to take my kids up there. My daughter actually was just in, um, a performance of the sound of music this past, um, spring. And it was so fun to see, and I know every single word and it's just, um, I know it's just a, it's amazing if you're ever in Saltsburg I highly recommend doing the sound of music tour.
Like it's super touristy, it's freaking super fun and amazing and, and it's super, and again, beautiful quality of life. Like you talked about mountains and lakes and [00:37:00] yeah, it's all there. Um, so now kind of shifting gears to kind of, to, you know, you've been up there for 10 years. Your perspective has changed.
You're focusing you have this healthier sense of creativity. Um, what's, what's exciting. You most about the future?
Marc DeSmet: Ah, right now, um, right now I'm chasing this notion of, um, longer span projects. I, I mentioned twin farms earlier. I'm thinking. I'm really thinking about these destinations that are multi-generational.
Um, I'm thinking about, um, how we can learn. I, and, and also twofold. I, I, maybe I jumped a little bit too quick there because we've, we've kind of got a two pronged fork going in our design discussions lately. One is the multi-generational. Um, You know, because we do, [00:38:00] uh, we're not just hospitality in our design firm.
We do, uh, high end residential. We do commercial, we do schools and other things too. Um, so it's about how does hospitality influence all those sectors? Not just, um, hotels, restaurants, nightclubs, but how does it influence all those sectors? And then. How do we make it? So it's not, um, how do we make it? So it's not, uh, dispensable, uh, commodity, uh, uh, something that's throw away in any way.
I'm very interested in the idea. Um, and maybe that's a, a, a stems from the fact that we're very, um, Environmentally sensitive. I mean, I don't think that's any news to anybody that people from Vermont are concerned about the environment. But, um, also the idea that, you know, we used to say that ho [00:39:00] uh, hotels was a great business because they had to reinvent themselves every five years.
Right. New case goods, new, this new, that stuff wears out. It's true. It does. And, and that's okay. But what if we think about things with greater longevity? What if we think about things in terms of multi-generational we're talking about, um, very interested in the idea that we could create a location that you wanna go back to over and over again.
Um, and maybe it's not every year, maybe it's not. Family vacation to, uh, Orlando that you took every summer for five years. It's something other than that. Uh, I think it's still being explored though. I don't, I don't, I guess I don't have a defined answer for you, Dan, but I think those are the things that are running through my head about where hospitality is going.
I see it stretching out into other sectors, but at its core, I see it, um, solidifying becoming more [00:40:00] enduring.
Dan Ryan: I love it. And I, and I agree. Um, and selfishly, I wish that the furniture would get changed out every five years. but it doesn't now it's more like 20 years. Yeah. I will say that. One of the things that I do love about furniture from like a footprint perspective yeah.
Is well designed and well built furniture used in a hotel. You really never have to throw it away because it can then go and be liquidated. It can wind up in another off market hotel motel. It can wind up in people's homes. Um, it just seems like. The O so many owners that we work with when they write their liquidation contracts, it's like, it doesn't go to landfill.
They are like, okay, you liquidate this. And then it goes and gets sold on the, on the secondary market. And not everyone does it, but many do. And I think more need to, especially as we start looking to at that cradle, DEC [00:41:00] cradle. Life cycle and footprint. Yeah. And, you know, going on to new England, um, new England, new England, does we just launched?
We just had the hotel Marcel open a couple weeks ago. It's the first net zero hotel. Um, In the us. Yes. So like, people are starting to think about it, like how, and I think people have always thought about it. It just kind of went away. Yeah. And now I think it's because investors and lenders, uh, it's important to them now.
So I think that, um, they wanna see measurements. They wanna see what does this all mean? How, how can we embrace this and, and show our guests that. While we're giving you an experience we're being mindful to not take too much.
Marc DeSmet: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Hmm. That we're not. Yeah, I agree. I agree. And, and the idea of, uh, something that popped into my head as you were describing that is, is it's multi-generational furniture.[00:42:00]
I'm talking about multi-generational spaces, but we're talking about multi-generational furniture, uh, to be more specific about it. And, uh, you know, uh, if it can't keep using it in one space, let's find a way to use it in another, or let's share it with somebody down the road. Totally. Um, you know, uh, let's, let's auction it off, uh, or, or make it available.
how great would it be? If I could buy that table from the foundation hotel and put it in my dining
Dan Ryan: room, you probably will be able to at some point . Um, but hopefully they're not renovating just yet, because I think, I think that that place is, like you said, it is just like, it is a place and a time that is just like, it just checks all the Bo it is like, it's meant to be.
Yeah, right.
Marc DeSmet: Yeah. I agree. I agree. I love that hotel [00:43:00] and I think Detroit's doing great things, not to just, you know, plug my hometown or anything. But, uh, I, I think there's been a lot of energy there, uh, over the last, um, I don't know, call it eight years. Um, it's, it's, uh, it's a lot of stuff to watch and, uh, foundation, hotel's just one.
Yeah.
Dan Ryan: Um, okay, so now sticking with the 313 so to speak. Yeah. Um, if you were to picture yourself at Detroit mercy in your architecture school, as the younger version of you. Yes. And I know you mentioned, uh, mentors of yours, like, uh, Jeffrey beers, for instance, as one mm-hmm . If you were to stand in front of yourself, the younger version of yourself that you of now, like what advice do you give yourself?
Oh
Marc DeSmet: my gosh. Um,
play the long game. Play the long game. That's my [00:44:00] advice to myself. Don't. You know, plant some seeds, give it time to grow. Don't rely on a media gratification, play the long game. It'll work out.
Dan Ryan: Love that. Play the long game straight at you from the 3, 1 3. You got it. Um, So mark, if people wanna get in touch with you, like what's the best way to, for, for people to learn more about, um, you or sch X Collins?
Yeah.
Marc DeSmet: Uh, I, the first place I would point 'em is to our website. Um, you can contact me through the website. My email is there and our phone number, obviously. And, um, that's the way to best way to get in touch with.
Dan Ryan: Just wanna say, thank you so much for your time. This has been great. And I, I didn't know that my, um, My Jean Simmons story would come out. So that [00:45:00] was like very exciting for me. uh, so for, so I, I,
Marc DeSmet: for the, for the, for the other, for the other part of, for the, uh, the after reel or whatever you wanna call it, I have a gene Simmons story too.
Oh,
Dan Ryan: good. We'll take that offline. And we can compare notes. the be real. The be real or the B-roll be real. Who knows as soon as I hit stop recording. Yeah. Um, We can talk about that. So, but I, now I'm very curious. Um, but seriously, thank you for your time. I mean, this has just been awesome and, and again, I resent you for being up there in Burlington.
I've
Marc DeSmet: got a guest room, Dan, you can,
Dan Ryan: oh, now you're gonna take, now I'm gonna take you up on it. We got beer,
Marc DeSmet: we got beers. We got sing-alongs in the backyard with, um, with other, uh, fish wannabees. And, um, you're always welcome.
Dan Ryan: awesome. And. [00:46:00] Also most importantly, too. I just wanna thank our listeners because we keep growing every single week.
And, um, I appreciate that. We all appreciate that because I think, I think we all care about how we make others feel. And if this episode has made you change the way that you think about how you make others feel and what hospitality means and how to be in a space of healthier creativity, like mark, please pass it on.
Uh, because it's all word of mouth and we appreciate you. And thank. Yeah.
Marc DeSmet: Thank you.