Defining Hospitality

[00:00:00]
Dan Ryan: Today's guest is all about the guest experience. She creates indigenous and authentically curated spaces.
She is a passionate and creative designer. She is a principle of hospitality, interior designer at DLR group. DLR group also had a go, I'm going to call it a gold key sweep for actually too many categories to list. And they also won designer of the year award at the, at the most recent gold key awards, ladies and gentlemen, Stacy patent.
Welcome Stacy.
Staci Patton: Thank you so much, Dan. This is great. Excited to talk to you today.
Dan Ryan: I'm so excited to talk to you too, and it's, [00:01:00] it's amazing how, um, I think we first met, I want to kind of let everyone in on this. So I was at the gold key awards and. You guys just like had a run of the table, it was wild. It was DLR deal or a deal or a deal.
And, um, so that was amazing. Um, I'm not going to say surprising. It was just cool because I've seen it happen. Kind of maybe once one other time, way in the past, but to see you guys be that successful. Um, and I think that this would actually be a great transition into our talk, but you've been with DLR group for 14 years, 13, 14 years.
Staci Patton: Something like, yeah, actually my anniversary for 15 is in the, I think July 4th. Give or take a day or two. So maybe those fireworks are for
Dan Ryan: that. No, they're definitely for that because I, I, I have a saying that I love throwing out at people and guests and just in life, I just say, uh, you know, after all these years you've become an [00:02:00] overnight
Staci Patton: success.
Right. It does kind of feel that way does,
Dan Ryan: but the point is, is it's not an overnight success it's you are just putting it, putting your time in you're you're grinding it out. And I just really feel like. Success is when hard work meets opportunity. Right. Right. And then also to bring it back. Um, so this sweep all happened, but then you had an after party at a bar that was right around the corner from where I used to live.
And I would bring my, I would walk my kids right past that bar on the way to school, past all kinds of crazy shit that I would see every single morning. That's like the one part of eighth avenue in New York city that, um, just, I think. Myself and my children, a tremendous educational. Kind of what's out there in the world, but it was fun to bond with you there.
And then it was, it had a great turnout. And again, thanks for your circuitous journey to this moment of you and me
Staci Patton: speaking. No, I loved it. Yeah, it was [00:03:00] great. That was a great night. And certainly one of those nights where, you know, you're kind of planning to have. You know, maybe a quick little cordial or two with some buddies that you have in the industry and just to see like the word of mouth and how it kind of caught fire.
And we had so many people coming in the door to thank us. And so, you know, definitely folks like you, new faces that we met and it's really, really lingered with us that sort of warm reception and sense of hospitality that, that we had that night. For sure.
Dan Ryan: Yeah. I guess in speaking of this fifth, almost 15 year journey, right.
Um, you guys have offices all over the place. Right, right. Um, and you're predominantly spending your T your time between Minneapolis and Chicago, correct? Right. And then, but you've also been throughout the pandemic and everything that I've seen, you've been growing your team and attracting really great, uh, people [00:04:00] to come work with.
You. It's how do you get this all done between all this and all the things that you do and like, how, how have you done this? Like, what's your secret?
Staci Patton: Oh my goodness. I don't even know my own secret. I, I think it's just such a, a passion that I have and. Really a, you know, a big credit to DLR to offer me the sort of platform to grow something that, um, you know, I would say I've been with the firm 15 years, but effectively our hospitality interiors practices is now up to eight years.
And so, you know, eight years ago, Myself and a colleague of mine raised our hand and we're like, Hey, we want to do hospitality, like full time, you know, like, not that we don't love these other sectors, but, um, let's just, let's do this. Like how do we do this? And so. It was really a piece by piece by piece and day by day by day and [00:05:00] an, you know, each client taking a meeting with us.
I mean, I think that's the first thing you have to get is a meeting
Dan Ryan: and people have to hear what you're, what you're throwing down, pick up on
Staci Patton: down. Yeah. Yeah. And so there's so much that has gone on between day one and two, the evening where we were bestowed that amazing honor. Designer of the year. And, um, I think it's just this constant curiosity and I, and I will say something that's even plagued me personally, even my early years as an artist is that I was never really happy with my final product.
I always thought it could be. You know, I would do a painting or a sculpture and I would be like, man, that's, that's kind of cool, but like, let's try again, you know? And, and I think that sort of drive my, uh, my boss says I'm a driver. And so I think it's just. Throughout the years, really driving and [00:06:00] finding great talent and finding great clients to, um, not only come and work with us, but, um, you know, give us some really amazing projects.
So a
Dan Ryan: hundred percent and, um, which colleagues. Of yours. Was it that you decided that you really wanted to kind of grow or birth this hospitality division?
Staci Patton: Yeah. So Joe Chikara, um, is our business development leader out of Chicago. And he actually was a very new hire for us at the time. He was tasked to come in and sell.
Quite a few sectors that were what we call private sectors. So workplace and mixed use retail, you know, maybe luxury housing and hospitality. And we were going through some transitions in those years of leadership and. Honestly, it was kind of like the kids were left to their own devices and we of course get some buy-in from our CEO and a couple other people, but we were just very [00:07:00] young and spunky.
And although he would hate for me to say that word. Um, but we were just, we had a drive and a passion and it was just, it was his job to run
Dan Ryan: sponsored by association.
Um, if you, so how did you guys put your heads together and get to that mower? It's like, Hey, we want to do this because a lot of that, obviously this is defining hospitality, but I want to get into like set the stage of where you and Joe were when that, like, if it was there a moment, was it a, a series of moments?
I just wanted to kind of paint a picture for you. Yeah, visualize.
Staci Patton: Um, well, I can take, I can take you through, I actually remember the day, um, very viscerally, like it was yesterday and it was a day that, you know, he had been invited from Chicago to come in and have some leadership meetings just regarding some leadership transition that we had.
And I was sitting at my desk and [00:08:00] he came over and we were just kinda catching up and, um, You know, we sort of were talking about hospitality and just how amazing the industry was. And, you know, again, with this sort of lack of leadership at that very moment, we, we kind of just leaned in and started to whisper a little bit about like, Hey, could we like do this?
Like we could do this. Right. We could do this. And I remember us like kind of slapping hands together and be like, yes, let's do this. And it really, what it meant at that time was just that I would start traveling to Chicago very regularly and start traveling. Um, Uh, across the nation to just meet with those that would take a meeting.
I mean, literally this was who would take a meeting with us. And so we really put our heads together and started to, uh, of course involve a few other key members of our team. Ed Williams was one of them who now leads our, um, hospitality sector globally. And, [00:09:00] um, of course getting our regional leader and our CEO to kind of buy into our Ponzi scheme.
Um, and I do give a job, a huge credit to just trying to understand who's out there. You know, what were the clients out there who were the movers and shakers in the industry that were doing work? And of course I had experience already in hospitality. I already had, you know, a couple of clients, um, that believed in me, Sage hospitality is one of them.
We started early on with Concord hospitality, who, um, you know, really interested in DLR group. And so we had some, uh, portfolio forming already. Uh, DLR group had done hospitality for. You know, 10 to 15 years prior, but in architecture and very sporadically there, there really wasn't a huge engine, um, behind it.
And so we kind of leveraged some older portfolio with [00:10:00] some of the new, and, um, I think what we learned along the way was that we had a new story to tell, and it really did shock us because. We didn't, um, S we didn't anticipate that owners were having really not so great experiences with designers and.
You know, we're, we're just selling a vision of collaboration. Um, we were selling a vision of what we call and what most people know today to be integrated design, which is that we would provide architecture and interior design. And, um, that historically for hospitality has always meant to be two separate entities.
And to some degree, it is still, you have an architect, you have an interior designer, you have a separate branding agency, but we were just sort of delivering our message along the path of, well, why would you want to [00:11:00] have pointing fingers? And why would you want to have two different people to run around and.
Really what we learned from owners because we went into these meetings, listening to them too. Was that. They wanted the creative tension and they wanted to ensure that these groups in house wouldn't mean a reduction of that creativity and enthusiasm. And so, you know, we got a couple of projects where we kind of proved that that's not the, that's not always the case.
Dan Ryan: I that's really interesting to hear because. That tension it's actually, it's like that idea of market and marketplace of ideas, right? You have the architect designer, brand owner, like all these stakeholders and the collision is in the ideas and the vision. Oftentimes that, I mean, in my experience that end result is always the blood, sweat, and tears to get you to that vision.
And [00:12:00] it's interesting to hear that people. I want that tension to get there. Obviously it's, it's intentional. The tension is intentional. Um, and I guess, how are you able to get over that? Uh, I guess that preconceived idea of, Hey, we'd like the tension that's part of our process.
Staci Patton: I really truly believe it was a mixture of just raw talent. And just raw entrepreneurship and we just. Kind of fucking figured it out. You know, we were just like, all right, go, let's create an amazing concept. And then when we paired that with our architects who also had an amazing concept or vision, and we just, we did the work, you know, we, we did in those early days a lot more than maybe we probably should have.
And that's also something to think about as the, as our profitability, but, um, Yeah. I, I [00:13:00] think that I had the role creativity too. And again, I, I credit my company, not really handcuffing me, you know, if I, if I needed something, I kind of got it and I did it.
Dan Ryan: So that's a great, that's kind of like, as you're talking, my wheels are turning to understand this.
So if DLR as. Now how many employees are there.
Staci Patton: So as a whole, I believe we're probably close to 1300 employees.
Dan Ryan: That's what I thought. So there's a ton. Yeah. Okay. And then eight years ago, how many. Oh,
Staci Patton: gosh. Oh,
Dan Ryan: about,
Staci Patton: I would say about half. I, I think, uh, our CEO has had some great acquisitions over the years that really doubled our size.
So I would say we were definitely no more than 500 at that time, so don't quote me on it, but okay. I won't
Dan Ryan: quote you. So the reason why the reason for my asking is, you know, I've heard you say. Leadership entrepreneurship, creativity like doing all these [00:14:00] kind of very creative, um, momentum gaining actions, right.
Which oftentimes when you hear these big company, That's antithetical to that. Right. So it's kind of exciting to hear. And then to hear you pepper in leadership, leadership, leadership, um, not just for the powers that be, but also for you and Joe to say, Hey, let's kind of take this crazy idea and run with it.
How do you think DLR as it, as a large organization is able to cause that's really interesting. And inspiring to hear like such a big company to foster and nurture this creative. Entrepreneurship, if you will.
Staci Patton: Yeah. Well, I think the one thing I do have to sort of mark as just walking down memory lane is this really came out of the recession around 2008, 2009, 2010, those years where.[00:15:00]
I know, right. I mean, our industry was decimated. We still feel that even to this day. And so it was a, it was a beginning, a new beginning of growth. And I think our company had seen because we're employee owned, um, you know, we're all owners here. Many of us who are principal level have a great amount of stock.
And so our company is very much about growth. And I think that they saw the sort of taking off of that particular industry and. When we had, when they had a few of us come to them and say, Hey, let's do this. I think that's what our company does is, is they invest, you know, we've had initiatives in Shanghai and Nairobi and, and, uh, you know, just, we, we have a budget, so to speak for investment, for innovation.
And I, we were like the little innovative thing [00:16:00] at the moment. And so I agreed that. You know, things happen for a reason. And I certainly understand that I may not have been given the same opportunity if I was at a different firm. Um, but I think they saw, they saw some opportunity and kind of gave us enough rope to then reign us back in if we needed help.
Yeah.
Dan Ryan: And you've just been off to the races. So now. Okay. So I want to dig into all that stuff, but before we get there, going back to the idea of you and Joe wanting to like having this crazy idea of like really being leaders within your company, to get those meetings and start hospitality. What drew you to it?
Like in the idea of hospitality in the experiment that this podcast and all these conversations are like, how do you. As you and Joe were talking about and the vision or the, whatever you felt out there that was your, your Pollstar. If you were like, how do you define hospitality?
Staci Patton: It's [00:17:00] the, it's the soul and the spirit of how we welcome people in.
And you know, it doesn't have to be a hotel. It doesn't have to be a restaurant it's really about. How you welcome someone in and what are those delights that you want them to receive? And, and what is it about your spirit? That you want to leave with them. And I think so often we kind of talk about hospitality as being a space.
It's really only one aspect to hospitality is the space in which we come to receive and delight and play and have, you know, joyful memories or sad memories or all the ones in between. And, um, You know, growing up in the south, I think that sense of hospitality was always ingrained in our upbringing, our culture it's I'll I always say [00:18:00] it's sort of the front porch, sweet tea, you know, you're just, Hey, you're waving to everybody in the neighborhood.
How's your day how's, you know, blah, blah, blah. And, um, that sort of is just part of who I am. And I knew that in, you know, as I went through my education in college, I knew Hotels were, where I felt the most comfortable in a weird way about how I could design them, but then also the experiences that reside within them.
Dan Ryan: So an interesting pattern that I'm seeing, not, not in our conversation, but looking at all the conversations I've had so far, when I'm speaking to guests who were talking about the built environment, they're the ones that are designing the built environment. So many of them are saying. It's actually the space is really just the shell.
It's really the being able to kind of facilitate the magic that happens in there. And then, and oftentimes it's, it's [00:19:00] really not about the hotels. It's about all this other stuff. So I'm really intrigued by all of the, just the growth and the opportunity and the innovation budget that you guys have as a, as a company.
And I'm trying to think how I can tie this, that idea. To when you started eight years ago, you and Joe would this crazy idea to now having how many designers there's 1300 total, but how many are on your hospitality to.
Staci Patton: Yeah. So we roughly have about 55 to 60 professionals and in hospitality and that's all they do day to day.
And they're really the five individuals that might be a buffer, or when we, you know, like to support our partners and our other sectors, maybe there's a big push that they have, or maybe there's a certain project, but an of that we have 25 interior designers. So. Proportion. Um, what suggests that, you know, half of our business is interior design alone, and half of it is [00:20:00] architecture.
Um, sometimes we even. You know, reflect on it being kind of a, you know, a third and a third, a third, because the more that we've been able to talk to owners about this integrated approach, we're winning projects that we are the architect and the interior design. And do branding. And, and so that is really, I think, exciting.
And we don't force any one particular arrangement on a client. I mean, if you've got a great architect, great. If you've got a great interior designer, great. Um, great branding agency, great. You know, we really just want to do great projects and work with great people.
Dan Ryan: And then, okay. So then going with that, the great people and specifically.
Those 25 to 50 enter designers and architects that are working on hospitality. But how do you in such a, in such a big company, get to that feeling of that front porch feeling, if you will, just to kind of quote what I heard you say, like, how do you, how do you [00:21:00] get everyone aligned to do all that within such a big company?
I'm really curious to hear that because everything that you've said so far. And how I met you in the CGU and all the things I've seen. I'm just amazed at it's a 1300 person company, because I feel like, yeah, it's a small company.
Staci Patton: It's really cool. That's absolutely perfect because I think we've always wanted to bring a much more kind of humble approach to the way we work with our owners and brands, you know, Marriott, Hilton, et cetera.
And then also just how we recruit our staff. Um, I'm very silly and I think I'm funny a lot and I'm at times inappropriate and I'm just not a stuffy kind of person. And I really try to let my personality shine through even from the first interview. Right. So [00:22:00] I'm, even from that outset, not going to give you this feeling like I'm so important and you know, I always want.
Kind of again, make you feel as though we're just sitting on the porch and we're all going to do great things together. And, um, that is, that is definitely our approach with owners. You know, we're we often talk about, we're not, you know, we're not a black Cape company, even though we have the size of it, you know, when you work on our projects, you work with us, this isn't the sales team, you know?
And so I think. That sort of approach to not only thinking about hospitality in the spaces that we designed, but thinking about it through how we actually come to work every day and how we actually engage with our team. Um, you know, maybe it's right, maybe it's wrong. But I like to feel as though our design team is like our family or their friends.
They're, you know, [00:23:00] we do, um, we like to hang out with each other. You know, and I, I think that's, I hope that that is how I inspire my team to rise high. Is that you can challenge me. I like it. When you challenge me, um, we can have great conversations. We can have hard conversations and we can sit in a bar or if we're traveling together and ideate, and then it's just, it's just fun and natural.
And I think that inspires them to see that you can one day be me or any one of my other principal colleagues just by being yourself. But, but work hard and work smart, but you don't have to be this stuffy corporate person, you
Dan Ryan: know? Yeah. And it's a pretty awesome balance in such a large company to have this feeling.
And then I think, you know, you've said leadership a lot. You said lead the team, [00:24:00] engage the team. Um, also, you know, I feel like oftentimes people see this idea of leadership as, um, It's like a, a God given skill. Right. But in my experience, it's not, oftentimes I find that it's it's activity and rhythm and engagements.
Right? Yeah. So keeping that in mind, like, what are your tools to both engage and lead? Like how, how do you engage and lead your team? I know you just mentioned a couple, but like when it gets down to like looking at your calendar, like, what are you.
Staci Patton: Yeah. Well, I think, you know, starting from the early days, I was always feeling as though I needed to be in service of, you know, as we began to hire teammates, we were hiring those who maybe needed a little bit more hospitality experience.
And, and for some of those that we hired had a lot of it. And so with each [00:25:00] individual person, I was just, how can I help. You know, is it, do you need something with software? Do you need help, you know, sketching this restaurant, do you need help really identifying, you know, what are our core objectives of this design?
So it was just always, how can I help you? How can I help you? How can I help you? And then, you know, as sort of the, the sort of chart of growth and that sort of ebb and flow, I started to notice that through being of service and teaching. It allowed others to kind of reach their peak were in. Then they went on to teach others.
And that's the cycle that I hope continues is that now I don't have to spend as much time intimately with perhaps my principal designers or my senior designers, because I've kind of built that, um, moment for them, for them to then go teach and. Really, I [00:26:00] feel as though that level of inspiration and mentorship and teaching and guidance and being of service to them has allowed them to rise to the occasion to help out.
'cause I can't do it all. I can't. I know
Dan Ryan: the other theme that I'm hearing throughout all these conversations in the idea of hospitality, it's like putting others first. Right. So to hear you say, how can I help you a hundred times or that you didn't say it a hundred times, but definitely a school. Right?
Um, it really translates. And I'm, I'm curious, is that throughout your company or if I'm sure it's throughout your company, but if you were to put all the different departments on escape, With the hospitality department, have that be maybe a heavier weight than the rest
Staci Patton: possibly. Possibly. I, I think we just, I think we give a lot of space, much.
Like I was given space to grow the sector. We give a lot of space for making mistakes and for taking initiative and [00:27:00] Hey, you got an idea. Let's do. Um, I think again, that's that space that I was given that I think we can continue to give our team so that they can find their own moments for innovation. I, I, 100% know that our company is a great place to work for, but there is something special about working in hospitality.
I really truly believe. Y we've even had so many internal teammates say like, Hey, I want to get on the hospitality team. Like, how do I do that?
Dan Ryan: Um, I actually, I want to dig into that one a little bit, because to win designer of the year, it's not for one particular project, it's taken a whole spectrum of projects together.
Right. I've also heard you say. That you have an innovation budget and that you give people leeway and you're nurturing their creativity. If you were to take that moment of getting that designer of the year, and then look at the innovation amongst the projects that [00:28:00] got you there, it could have been, it could be over those eight, eight years of really, since you and Joe kind of ran with it, but is there a, a project or a moment in a project?
That's a really good example of. Innovative and nurturing thinking.
Staci Patton: Oh yeah. Um, I think that in maybe a different way, uh, you know, we have, we've done quite a few projects, but when we did the canopy Minneapolis, um, it's a historic building. Did, um, architecture and interior design. And it was truly a just profound moment of change.
I believe for our studio. And really the innovation came through. Trying to figure out how to return this, this building, the structure to its glory, um, and do it in such [00:29:00] a way that is truly integrated. I mean, down to, okay, we have this, we need to move it over four inches and it's an architect and interior designer.
You know, side by side, mapping that out. In addition to sustainability, you know, really returning something back to its community. The building had sat there for years as an office space. It was originally a, um, agriculture warehouse, uh, building, but it wasn't really public. It wasn't there to give back to the community until we got our hands on it with our client.
And so that, um, project, you know, we didn't make money. So in terms of how our company saw that as well was, uh, an investment in ourselves. It was a huge moment to prove to the industry that we can not only be wonderful storytellers. We can be sensitive to these older structures and. Provide a living room [00:30:00] to the community.
And so while that may not sound like a cool techie innovation for us, it was innovative because it was like we were finally doing it. We're finally bringing together lifestyle design. You know, we worked with Hilton, we worked with our community members. We worked with local makers and it was like we were doing it.
And that. The great part of what I feel that project represents is, um, is a moment where we could prove it. And then from there is where I think we started to see a lot more interest in our team, um, from a, from a perspective of what we truly are, which is an integrated from.
Dan Ryan: Yeah, I think it's also interesting to look at that as an investment, um, as well, it's a relatively new brand for Hilton as well, too.
Right. So it's pretty exciting to see and hear you say that from an adaptive [00:31:00] reuse perspective and also all of the, um, the investment that Hilton has made in that brand as well. I think it's one of the coolest, um, new brands to launch. And if you also look at it with. The calendar or like within the ebbs and flows or cycles of our industry, like where that thing opens and really in earnest at the beginning of the pandemic.
Uh, canopy a week open, almost. It felt like
Staci Patton: I know. Right? Yeah. And you know, a lot of people may say, oh, well, it's not truly boutique, but I honestly, the approach that we took to this project would be the exact approach that we would take had there not been a major hotel flag on it. We told the story. If it's legacy, we told the story of those who had come there and why they would come there and, um, and really derive the concept around weaving, which was really weaving the community [00:32:00] back to this place.
And of course the inside structure of this building is basically, uh, a Jinga of timbers that are woven together to create the structure. And, um, and so, you know, for a moment, you're just saying. I'm not designing a Hilton as much as I'm designing a canopy for this place, for this neighborhood and for the people who want to explore it and feel it, and like, know that they're there, this sense of place.
So, yeah, I think it was, um, I think it was a really great project and I know Hilton's really proud of it. Yeah, I know
Dan Ryan: they are too. Um, when I think of projects or initiatives that I've been involved with that have either broke even or lost money. There are always tremendous learning experiences as well.
Right. And you know, if we don't learn from our mistakes or challenges, um, we're doomed to repeat them. So if you were to look at [00:33:00] this as a, as a break, even project, but as an investment, that was, that is tremendously successful. Um, what was your. Learning from getting this project done and doing that adaptive reuse, which I see is happening more and more and more.
And I want it to happen more and more and more.
Staci Patton: Yeah, I think for us, we felt we were poised to deliver a story. We knew that our talent was there to deliver the building. We knew our client Sherman associates with. Madly in love with their neighborhood as they own most of it. Um, so we had so much going for us.
I think what we'd learned the most, um, which did prepare us for future work is just how much time these special projects take. And that equates to fee and also blood, sweat, and tears. [00:34:00] But I think we came out of it saying right now we know how to play with the big dogs. We know the time that goes into it and how that equates on a business perspective.
And. I'm a designer through and through, right? Like I hate looking at spreadsheets. In fact, there was a time where that was my job and I was like, no, no, no, please fire me from this. Cause I don't want to do spreadsheets. And I love the fact that we need to be a healthy company, but like, can I just go, you know, play in design.
And so it was a moment for even myself to say, okay, this is how it really truly stacks up. And. We took that as many, of course, there's many other lessons that we learned, but it allowed us to truly begin a new conversation with ownership about our services and how much they cost. Um, you know, we had taken a lot of work for maybe a little to, again, prove ourselves, prove ourselves.
And, and we're very grateful for that, but it finally gave us a place to say, [00:35:00] Hey, you know, this is, this is what we can do. And this is how much, um, We'd like to see paid for. Well,
Dan Ryan: it's interesting you say that. And um, because before the pandemic I heard, I forgot who it was. They were talking about fees, um, consulting fees, and I think it would apply to our industry, but it could have by across.
Histories, but I think specifically in our industry, um, since the financial crisis of 2008 to 10, or whenever we started to really come out of that one, we were not really w when I say we, hospitality consultants were not really able to raise their prices. It was almost as, Hey, we just made it through this, this downdraft on our fees, so to speak and.
I'm curious how you're seeing things now, because after those lessons and the value, because really that story and everything is really about like how much value are you bringing? Are you finding [00:36:00] ownership, groups more understanding about the need? Not just with inflation, but just also the value you're bringing to be able to, um, charge for your, your fees charge appropriately for the
Staci Patton: value you're bringing.
Yeah. You know, I think we're all in. A weird phase that I, I would say none of us have it figured out yet. Um, I don't think any of us could have ever anticipated. Coming out of the pandemic with the sheer volume of work that these owners and developers want to get done. And when you combine that with the fact that we were not alone in the fact that we had to lay some people go, um, lets people go.
But we also hired quite a few of our teammate back. And so we're dealing with the volume. Uh, we're dealing with really not. [00:37:00] Um, there's just not, we always, I been joking about this with a couple other firms. I was like, where are all the designers? And they're like, I think they just don't exist. I think we have that much work that we need to grow more humans in design.
And I, I think they're right. I mean, I, I think that a lot of the. Um, transition that a lot of families are, or just folks who maybe wanted to try something new in life, made a decision to leave the industry. And so now we're dealing with the shortage and we're dealing with inflation and we're dealing with escalation at 30, 40, and gosh, near 50% on construction costs.
Right. So we just have this like mega hot sector that just wants to go. It is absolutely. Oh, and by the way, our teammates that we have currently, as well as new incoming teammates are commanding more in salary. [00:38:00] And I'm not saying they shouldn't, I'm just saying like, it is just this you're you feel like your head is like on those like pressure points and it's just pushing and pushing and pushing.
And so where I'm going with this is the. We do see a need to raise our fees to balance, um, everything from the demand and schedules, the, um, potentially added staff that we have to have. Um, perhaps at some points it's even a longer schedule. It's all connected. It's all an ecosystem and that's, I'm not an expert, but I can tell you that this is an ecosystem and there's not going to be one way to fix it.
But we hopefully, as an industry can from the owner side developer side, as well as the designer side can be mindful of that. We are in a moment and we might have to adjust to this moment. Um, I think. [00:39:00] What I would probably take a bet on is that owners are afraid that if they, um, kind of go for those higher rates of design fees, that it'll always stay that way.
And that's something to be concerned about, but I'm not sure that that will truly pan out.
Dan Ryan: Yeah. I mean, look, it is a competitive marketplace and pricing usually figures itself out. We are in this perfect storm of everything you've been talking about. Um, I also. I appreciate that you guys are employee owned as well, because I would think in that you're seeing.
P and L's, you're, you're part of the open book journey, and look, we companies need to make money,
Staci Patton: right? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I think our company's very transparent as they are required to be. Um, but we share in our successes and our losses together as a team because they know how these projects are going.
Um, we place, uh, a high [00:40:00] significance. Um, value on project management and we asked of those project managers to communicate to their teams, the financial success, or, you know, what's going on or, you know, how can we course correct. And honestly, that was what we do today. Dan was not what we were doing early on.
You know, so much of our growth in such a short time of eight years is trial and error. What has worked, what hasn't and, you know, we're, we're kind of figuring out our stuff finally, which feels great. And the design acumen has always been there. It's, it's really the business side that we've grown up with kids.
Dan Ryan: Yeah, totally. And then in the bit, on the business side, As, as far as like getting all this to come together, like what, what's an indispensable tool for you to get your job done and continue to grow your teams the way you're growing them and nurture them.
Staci Patton: Uh, it's my designers and they're design. [00:41:00] Because truth, truthfully, the owners and developers that we work for are obviously trusting in us that we know how to run a business.
They don't need to be, you know, a part of that. What we will always be called back for his design and how we delivered our service. You know, where we were. We great to work with where we responsive. Did we understand budget as well as high design? You know, where we practical, but visionary, you know, those are all those, those things that you balance.
And I cannot do that without my. So they would be my indispensable
Dan Ryan: tool. I love it. And then if you were to kind of going with that and all the other things that we spoke about, um, all those challenges, but also this idea of, of growth and excitement, what's exciting. You most about the future?
Staci Patton: Ooh. Um, [00:42:00] I actually am really excited for.
Just the future of sustainability. I think we have to think about that in a different and new way for hospitality spaces. Um, I, 100% believe that we will always want spaces that are comfortable, that we can have a great cocktail, that you can see the ocean, that you can rent a bike and explore the neighborhood that you all.
Have a feeling of great service and hotels. What we have to do, I think for the future is work on the background. So the background is efficient. It's sustainable. It's. Purposeful and that it supports our local community and that may not be like a syllable thing to a guest. And that's fine. That's totally fine.
But I think we, as an industry really need to kind of understand what's happening in the world and understand our place in making a big impact.
Dan Ryan: You know, [00:43:00] I've spoke with Joanna Abrams from a company called mind click. I don't know if you've heard of them. Have you heard of them? Oh yeah. So I was on a panel with her also at, uh, in November.
At BDN Y and she had this article. I can't remember who wrote it. I met him. I can't remember his name. I see his face, but it was, it was basically that if you look at the co the, the, the, um, the lifespan of a building, like let's take canopy Minneapolis, for instance, that building was built when like more than a hundred years ago, correct?
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So if that building were built today, it would be most of the sustainability credits that are measurable. It's all based on that corn shell of as it's built today. But if you look at that building and then over its life span of more than a hundred years, right. And you look at all of the different life cycles of product and or furniture or whatever use it was that went through it, all the things that make its way into and out of through the renovation cycle have a larger [00:44:00] impact than the actual building itself.
Yeah. And I think it's an exciting time because I think what frustrated me about lead and. Environmental measurement systems, if you will, is that it didn't really apply to the stuff that we're doing inside the building,
Staci Patton: right? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think furniture manufacturing is always one of those areas that, um, I think probably has the largest challenge we have.
Just the economy of scale. I mean, any one hotel has 120 rooms to gosh, like 1200, right. So you've got a lot of furniture. So I think that's one opportunity. Um, but I think where we can really think beyond some of those pieces, like you said, is, you know, how. Teammates that are hired, run the hotel. Could we make their lives easier?
Could we [00:45:00] make things a little bit more efficient? Could we, instead of, you know, ordering product from, you know, another land, could we maybe have a local maker who's down the street, do it. Cause it would be so much more rewarding to them and it would kind of keep that economic impact being local, which I think.
A whole big part of sustainability that we don't really talk about. And like you said, it isn't measurable on a corn shell checklist. It's just, it's measurable in a different way. And I'm excited for I'm excited for more talks and panels and really kind of getting that message out there to our industry.
I think our designers are very smart. Every, every designer is very smart. And instead of talking about perhaps. Uh, material innovation. Let's start talking about how we, as designers can really impact, like I said, sort of the behind the scenes so that it's elegantly [00:46:00] choreographed. And it's just part of our issues, part of our process.
Let's just say
Dan Ryan: I agree. And I think also I think the step one is being able to measure things and I think as we figure out how to do this, and it's being figured out on the interior side of things, We might not like the measurements we see. Right. But that's okay. Because if we don't measure, we're not aware of it.
We can't change it. And to me, we're at this very early stage of changing and now banks are requiring it as long as lenders part of their underwriting. Um, investors are wanting to do it as part of their equity portfolio or a family office or institutional fund. Um, so I think we're at this really cool hinge point and I'm super excited.
Where it's all going to, um, one other question, like going back to Florida state, how did you decide, how did you decide interiors?
Staci Patton: Oh my God. I love this. Um, I'll give you the short version. So I grew up with a [00:47:00] dad, um, who was very artist. And would always draw. And so I feel like I got some of the next from him.
And then my mom really loved home renovation was like always deco pausing and some wallpaper thing. And like, this is the new technique of the, of the month. And, um, you know, of course as HD TV came out, she was like, number one, a. But, um, when my mom remarried, um, my stepdad and my mom would just be constantly fixing up the house.
And so I was always kind of around the thought of, of home and changing your home to really suit your need. Um, I sort of was ignoring that for a little bit and thought let's do the journalism thing. So I was of course, on the newspaper staff, like a class nerd and, um, enjoyed the interview and the [00:48:00] writing and putting it together.
And my team in high school. Um, that was on a newspaper stuff. We were just kind of like having fun and I have some of the best memories of working with them. So I, you know, went on to, um, Florida state thinking that I would just continue in the journalism path. And, um, I had some great friends who were around me a lot and of course my mom and they were just like, are you sure?
That like journalism is kind of your thing because you're very artistic. You're always drawing and painting and sculpting. And so anyway, I kind of listened to them actually. And I looked into the Florida state program and apparently it was like a really great program. And so I gave it a shot and it was really an amazing experience because it was, I finally felt I found something that I felt I was just naturally.
Dan Ryan: Yeah. Well, you know, it's interesting as you're saying that as well. [00:49:00] Um, I heard you say the word storytelling about 10 times through this as well, not just for you, but for your company, for the building, for your team. And to go into that and see that initial draw towards journalism and being able to chart out and tell the story that makes total and complete sense.
Staci Patton: Yeah. I've enjoyed growing up to understand that that is my.
Dan Ryan: Yeah, what doesn't make sense is how you could go from, um, Tallahassee to Minneapolis.
Staci Patton: Do we have more time? We need drinks.
Dan Ryan: I'll I'll I'll make that happen. Uh, when I see you in person. Hopefully, I'll see you in June for that, um, HD awards. Are you coming in town for that? Yes,
Staci Patton: I am. So I would love to see you we'll we'll rendezvous at the same point.
Dan Ryan: Awesome. Okay. But now one of the questions I love asking is, okay, so let's say [00:50:00] you Stacy, that I'm speaking to right now, go back to the Stacey.
That's changing from journalism to interior design in Tallahassee. What advice does the Stacey of today give the Stacey of Tallahassee?
Staci Patton: Oh, I would tell myself and anyone to just stop listening to the internal dialogue that says that, like you, you can't achieve something. You know, when, when I was early on in my career as just a very young designer, I was very happy punching the clock and, and just not even seeing myself as being a senior member of the team, I don't know what I was thinking.
I literally don't know what I was thinking. So I think I would just tell myself and any other designer to just totally be open to where you're going to go, because where you're going to go. You don't even know. [00:51:00] And if you just do a great job and show your passion and at all points in time, just keep your personality at the forefront.
I think those are the recipes for just success and whatever spectrum it is. It doesn't have to be leading a studio. Be on any other level. Um, so I do look back on those days. I'm like, well, was I thinking like,
Dan Ryan: well, okay. And then, so then, cause I guess part of this whole thing for me doing this podcast, like who would have thought I would have been doing this in addition to all the other things I'm doing, but it was just kind of opening up and being open to what.
People are saying to me about me, or I'm kind of thinking about how can I kind of fill in the blanks on an industry that I love and I just want to be open to it. So like, what do you think caused that change? Cause I'm seeing you look at yourself back then and be like, what was I thinking? Like, how was I, so what prompted that change within you?[00:52:00]
Staci Patton: So it, honestly, I think what we're going to have over drinks in June. Oh, wow. That that's the whole, why did you, why did you go from. Warm to cold.
Dan Ryan: Yeah. What prompted that trans operation within you to just kind of open up to experience and just do it?
Staci Patton: Yeah, so I, I think it was honestly, the recession had, um, impacted again, this is back in those early days that we were talking about it had impacted our entire department. I mean, my college. We're being, let go.
It was like seven people a day. I mean, it was just like, oh my God. And so I was really at this point in time, kind of the last designer left in, in, in Minneapolis. And I was just like, oh, gay dokie. I guess it's really from here forth my, [00:53:00] my job to keep my job and, um, You just had to kind of pull up your, your boots or your heels and you just had to do it.
So I think it was just coming out of a necessity and tapping into natural leadership that I didn't know that I really had, but I guess it was living in there somewhere. And I just put one foot in front of the other.
Dan Ryan: Yeah, I hearing you said that I, I love ancient history and there was this. During the Peloponnesian wars.
I forget if it was the Athenians. I think it must have been the Athenians. They went to Sicily to Syracuse to go beat, uh, I dunno, take over this to take over Syracuse, but the Admiral who brought them there, he basically all the soldiers got off the boat and then he burnt all the ships and he said,
Staci Patton: Wow. And you're kinda like, oh, okay, well I guess where [00:54:00] it's either this or, you know, we have no land, all extreme. I hope I never do something that is extremely
Dan Ryan: in a way you were kind of there on the beach. They
Staci Patton: kind of burned my
Dan Ryan: ship. Yeah. Yeah. Your ships were burned and it's like, all right, I got to figure this out and move forward.
I heard you say move forward. Yeah. Awesome. Well, Stacy, how can people connect?
Staci Patton: Yeah, so totally, uh, look me up on Instagram, Stacy patent ISP, as well as you can check out our website DLR group.com. I'm also on LinkedIn, Stacy Patton and sorry guys. I got a Facebook,
Dan Ryan: Instagram, technically is Facebook. I know, right?
I want to say, thank you so much for your time. This has been awesome. And a long time coming and congrats on all of your success.
Staci Patton: Thank you so much. You're just such a peach and thank you for reaching out to have a discussion. I'm so excited for people to learn more about dealer group, but it's also nice to tell our [00:55:00] journey.
I think a lot of people don't realize. You know what had transpired in that such short time. So, and thank you to boutique design and hospitality design for giving us those great awards.
Dan Ryan: Yeah. Well it, thanks to them, but it's also all of the. All the judges, right? I mean, it's not. Yeah. So you're in good.
You're
Staci Patton: in good hands. A lot of stakes and wine gifts to these
Dan Ryan: judges. Yeah, exactly. Um, so I also want to say thank you to all of our listeners. Um, this has been growing and it's because of these really interesting conversations with our amazing guests like Stacy. Um, so if this has changed your idea of hospitality and how to deliver it, Please pass it along.
It's all word of mouth. I appreciate it. And we'll see you next time.
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