Defining Hospitality

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Dan Ryan: Today's guest is an innovative industry leader. He's a hospitality guru. He's senior director of design and project management for luxury brands at Marriott International. He's an architect by training and a converted admirer and raving fan of interior design. Ladies and gentlemen, Aldo Barrios.
Aldo,
Oswaldo Barrios: welcome. Hello, how are you? Welcome.
Dan Ryan: It's so good to see you. Um, I don't know if many people know, but I think what I'm most intrigued about with you because like one of my [00:01:00] heroes as far as the independent or the lifestyle boutique hotel world is Ian Schrager. And you came out of the blue with very little or no hospitality experience.
You can clarify that in a second, to help kind of pilot the launch of Addition Hotels, which was the joint venture between Ian Schrager and Marriott. And I think, and this also comes up a lot in these conversations where. It's this idea of rookie smarts. It's having someone come in with no experience, but you have the skill set to like execute vision and create space.
Um, but having a fresh perspective and no baggage to help create this incredible thing that addition has become. And now, um, how did all that happen? Like how did, how did you wind up coming from no hospitality experience to really championing an incredible, um, [00:02:00] initiative, which is addition hotels within our industry and I would say a transformative, um, initiative within our industry.
Especially because to me, what's also so unique about it as well is, you know, Ian Schrager was just kind of always out in his own world and Marriott's this huge corporation and I don't know, it just seemed so cool to bring those two things together to create this unique experience to. How did it all come to
Oswaldo Barrios: be?
Yeah, but first of all, let me, um, thank you for having me over, having me in in the podcast today. Um, you know, it's been, I've been with, uh, with, uh, addition for about 15 years now. So it's been a long ride and it has had many, many changes up and down, but, uh, the way it started, so, um, my, my, um, background is in architecture.
So I went to school in, uh, architecture school in, um, Venezuela. Got a five year degree over [00:03:00] there. Uh, then I moved to the US to do some, um, master studies and, you know, just tried to look at something different. Uh, so I was pretty much basic on the traditional or. Train on the traditional way of architecture.
So I was doing, you know, I did some design work and master planning, uh, retail planning, a little bit of everything. You know, like when you're in architecture, you do whatever comes in. Correct. Um, and then through a friend of mine that I did some work with in my own firm, and she was now working in Marriot on the geo design side of Marriot, she reach out to me and said, Hey, you know, there's rumors here about, you know, a new brand and they looking for somebody, you know, are you interested in all that?
So, well, you know, that sounds like up an interesting change, you know, after you've been doing other stuff for a while. And, um, So I went an interview, uh, uh, and then found out, you know, [00:04:00] the, the company had this plan to create a new brand actually from the scratch in the company. And they were looking for somebody that didn't have any preconceptions on, on any of hospitality, um, design.
In my previous life, I've done very, very little hospitality in terms of, and always from the architectural point of view, you know, of the planning, but really, really nothing significant. So, um, so I made, you know, the, the hired manager and, and, you know, go to know the idea and then more and more know about it.
It became more intriguing. Um, keep in mind that this is when Marriot was, it's not like a mart you have right now, which has, you know, 35 brands and there's a lot of life, uh, brand component and the, and the company. This was very, um, The company was still very much like a myriad and a courtyard and, you know, very, the core of, of our business.
So, um, there was this [00:05:00] idea of occurring the boutique hotel and, you know, the idea of this partner with this gu of, uh, of a boutique hotel design, you know, and I mean, to be honest, I was just, it's all new to me, so it was pretty neat. Um, so I, so yeah, the, the idea, you know, um, Marriott wanted to create this boutique brand, but they didn't want it to be anything like the brands we had before.
Uh, the, the history goes that Mr. Marion went to, um, was presented opportunity. He was reluctantly, he know, he was much more conservative in a sense. Um, and this was kind of a little bit out there. Um,
Dan Ryan: so, uh, a little bit, I think like if you go back 15 years when that's there, I don't think it's a little bit, I think it's.
It's so far out there that to bring these two totally different worlds together is like, I would say, revolutionary. It was so, it's [00:06:00] surprising and crazy.
Oswaldo Barrios: It was, uh, it was crazy. I mean, it, it's funny, we have some presentations of the brand. When you have the two of them, you know, portraits of the, the two of them at the sentiment, you, you realize how, how drastic the, the difference was.
But, uh, but what happened, what did it, I think it was, uh, Grammarcy Park, telled. So in those days, grammar Street Park was just open and it was like really, um, a big success, um, in the design world. Of course, everybody, you know, everybody was so interested and it's, I mean, it's a beautiful hotel. Uh, and I was so, you know, um, almost, uh, like a sonography, you know what I mean?
Like, like a theater set, you know, was so, so intense. Uh, so Mr. Me went and visited the, the property, uh, and told the hotel and made we and all that. So long story short, I wasn't there, but, um, that was what convinced Mr. Murray to move ahead with the partnership and kind of like to [00:07:00] see, you know, this, this is something that could work.
So back to, to my role. So that's when I started, you know, we, you know, one of the first things that we did is we, when I. Meet with Ian and go see Grandma City Park and to Grammar City Park and all that. And uh, one of the basic things that, that I was told as part of the Bur team at the beginning is that we want to have a hotel that doesn't look like a Marriott.
Doesn't feel like a Marriot doesn't that people doesn't know it's a myriad. It's just for the fact. But when it's something different, so when it's some, something that wasn't tainted by, um, You know, uh, all habits and all rules and, and, um, you know, that this should be like this done because it always been done this way type of attitude.
You know, this is where we do things, you know? So I couldn't bring that any of that because I never done it. So it was a, it was a perfect match. And, uh, the interesting thing about it is working with Ian and working with his team is that, uh, they will question a lot of [00:08:00] our, our standards. You know, we have a, a big book of a, you know, bible of standards, um, and, um, they will question a lot of these things.
You know, why do you have to do this? Why is the reason why, you know, which she was real interested for me being early on in the process that I have to really
Dan Ryan: think about it. And actually that's, that's really incredible to hear because they brought you in as having, I mean, you have, you've experienced hospitality before, but from what I heard, what I heard from you speaking earlier, As an architecture, as a designer like you, you never worked in that space, right?
So you're getting this crash course to bring these two things together immediately. I'm hearing you say that the Schrager team is like, why are all these standards the way that they are? And you're there kind of as the go between with having no experience, I guess. Like how did you define, and I want, I want to get more into [00:09:00] the story as well, but like, how did you define hospitality before that first meeting and getting all those standards and dissecting them, and then over the 15 years, how has your definition of hospitality um, evolved?
Oswaldo Barrios: Well, it changed a lot. Definitely. I mean, before, I would say before, um, before I started working in Maryland, in addition, my hospitality idea was more of. the traditional hospitality, the really, you know, overdone spaces and very impressive, stairs dripping down into the lobby and all that, Uh, and that was kind of like the image that you have, you know, the, um, you know, the fancy restaurant with Table cloth and everything perfectly laid out and all that around you. And, and this, uh, so when I started, um, you know, or after I've been doing, um, been working on Edition for a while it's changed so much because now the way I see it hospitality hospitality's [00:10:00] It's a combination between what you feel and, the experience that you get into the space. And that is combined design, combined service, every little piece of it, the way that somebody talks to you and the way that, the space feels and smells.
And, um, and in the, I think that the, the big difference is that, uh, you have to combine all these pieces together, uh, really carefully. You know, it's one of the things that we do, I think, very well in, in our brand is that, uh, we are very close team that works together, the operation part of the team with the design part of the team, but we are really careful about how things work seamlessly.
And, uh, you kind of, in a way, you're kind providing the stage for this, for the, for the staff to do their work and all that, you know? And you do
Dan Ryan: know. So you, so it's, so, it's like you just said something interesting. You were providing a [00:11:00] stage for them to do that.
Oswaldo Barrios: It is a stage. Cause you know, it is a little bit of like, that's what you're doing.
You're doing a stage for staff, you're doing a stage for people to, to a little bit of perform and sit down and enjoy the space and enjoy a bar, and show a lobby. But the whole thing is, you know, the light of it, you know, for example, is a really important piece, um, for us, you know, that you will see, for example, you go, when you go into our, uh, reception into the check in desk that, you know, in some hotels you have these really beautiful plants or whatever, this in the back artwork piece, you know, that.
And, and a registration is very focusing on the person that is gonna talk to you, you know, hmmhmm the stuff that's gonna receive, you know, that. And everything is just kind of like a little bit of background to that experience instead of trying to grab the attention from the experience.
Dan Ryan: So when I, when you first started talking about, you know, your initial.
Just how [00:12:00] you experience hospitality, not as a designer. I got the sense that it was, um, a lot of this grand over the top luxury flat press tablecloths, and then I heard it kind of transform into this idea of a stage, right. For a stage for the guests, a stage for the, the team working there. Um, and, and the overall experience.
So that's a, that's a very different journey from your original, like just the, the how you identified hospitality when, when you began to where you are now or to where you've evolved. Now where you are is like, how do you define hospitality now after these 15 years of experience of merging these two really different, um, ideas of hospitality together?
Oswaldo Barrios: Yeah. Uh, hospitality in general, you mean? Yeah, it's, uh, um, You know, it, it is, you know, it's one of the, one of the, the [00:13:00] amazing things about working in hospitality is like the ingredient of the people that work in the hotel is so important. You know what I mean? Mm-hmm. and, um, on, on the luxury side of things, you know, and I don't know, it's because maybe the change in in people's or in the population age maybe changes.
There's a lot of younger people that can afford luxury level things. So, so you get into a lot more, someone, like I said, an informal luxury experience in hospitality, um, but is, um, informal, but um, in a sense, you know, for example, in. To explain a little bit better. On, on, on addition, we always talk about kind things for what they are, you know, in, in, um, in, in a old fashion or a more traditional luxury property.
You call in room dining, for example. In addition, we call it room service. You know, we're more, it's more like straightforward, more [00:14:00] like, you know, it is what it is. MoveOn, you know, security guy. It's not the loss prevention, whatever, whatever. It's just a security person on the property, you know? So we, we try to be a little bit more, less or less of that type of a, you know, um, all like, we think this is old fashioned luxury, a little more, more modern, contemporary way to do it.
But that doesn't mean that it's not a sophisticated space or it is a, you know, there is a lot of carefully, you know, um, attention to detail and things, you know, but it is in a different level. Um,
Dan Ryan: but why do you, why do you think. Actually before I ask that question, so in hearing
the vision of, of Mr. Marriot to kind of make this deal happen with Schrager to do edition, it's, you know, you had the old school Marriot, then this new addition thing new, it was almost like the, the spear [00:15:00] point of a new direction that now Marriott has what, like 30 something brands they've really filled in the whole spectrum of lifestyle, independent, all the way to luxury, all the way to the back like that from the courtyard all the way up to the addition or St.
Regis or, or what have you. Um, but I think it was an important, um, trailblazing move to help get Marriott to where they are now. Why do you think for such an important endeavor, that spear tip of you, if you will, of this new evolution, why do you think they would put someone like you in there? With no experience of hospitality
Oswaldo Barrios: because I, I think, and then again, I think that's, that's the whole idea not to get, um, in, in one way to, to let Ian be the stronger piece of the, of, of the team in the sense that, you know, not getting into the, [00:16:00] into the, into the, you know, doing things the way they, they usually done and more learning from what he brought to the team.
You know what I mean? That the idea of the time was like, you know, we need to. We need to absorb this and, and, and make sure they protect this brand from, um, from the rest of the operation. You know, I mean, it's, it's a big company, so it's, uh, and having this separate kind of secluded team and, and, you know, for the, for a long time we were kind of like a little bit quiet because we didn't have any properties open and we are still trying to figure out, um, the way we do things and the way, and, and from.
Development point of view, you know, it's hard to start property, uh, or start a brand with having nobody, uh, knows about it, you know, because everybody comes after they've seen some, you know, outside owners and interested developers, but you don't have anything to show for. It's very hard to, to, um, to do it.
So for the longest time we were working on a set of [00:17:00] visibility mode, looking at properties, looking at this very quietly, you know, we used to, we called the boutique hotel in, in the company. We didn't have a name even by then. So,
Dan Ryan: so, um, how, how long was that before? Okay. So you came in, you interviewed, you got hired by Mart to be the outsider.
How long did that onboarding for you at Marriot last before you got, um, indoctrinated into, um, Schrager's world?
Oswaldo Barrios: Oh, that started right away. I mean, like I tell, we met Ian, uh, and his team, the, probably the first couple months of it started. So it was just a starting point. Um, and we, we took from there. Uh, and
Dan Ryan: sorry, well wait, just, just to build on that one.
So it was a, you met the, you met with that team pretty much right away. Yeah. And then how, then you, you have to concept and come up with this and kind of sell the vision to outside developers and owners. How long was [00:18:00] it from when you first connected with them till you had your first. Shovel in the ground, so to speak, but it's,
Oswaldo Barrios: uh, oh, you know, it probably went about a, I would say about a year and year or so that we went through the whole process of, you know, we had standards.
Can we adopt the standards to this brand? And, you know, do we wanna have standards, you know, questioning every little piece of it, coming up with an ideal program for a hotel, what it should have, or it shouldn't have, you know, look at another hotel to see, should we model after Grammarcy Park or after any other, uh, you know, uh, type of property was what should be a room size.
You know, should we have a separate toilets in the bathrooms? You know, all, all that kind of like, you know, trying to decide, um, how the, the branch should, should, you know, be and what the program should be and before even how it's gonna look, you know? Uh, and,
Dan Ryan: and then, and then also, so actually to me, I'm [00:19:00] surprised to put these, these two different parties together.
Than to just go to have a shovel in the ground after nearly one year. And all that con, that seems like super fast to me. You were very fast. Yeah. That's really impressive. And he was, what was it, what was it like when you first met, um, Ian and his team? Like what, what, what if you go back into your memory, like what did that, yeah, what did that feel like?
You've been indoctrinated a bit in the Marriot onboarding, right? And then you're, you're introduced to there. What was that first experience like?
Oswaldo Barrios: It was, it was very exciting to be honest. I mean, by the time I was there already, you know, um, Knew more about Ian and the work he's done and all that. And, uh, and of course I was very impressed and, and admiring that all that work he has, you know, developed through the years.
So it felt like a little, like, you know, you, you are like, you're in a really important place in time, you know what I mean? This is a great opportunity. This is a, [00:20:00] you know, you kind of get the sense that this is, doesn't happen every day and doesn't happen for everybody, you know? So it's a pretty, pretty good feeling to have.
Um,
Dan Ryan: so a feeling of like inspiration and excitement.
Oswaldo Barrios: Yeah. This is something big we're gonna be doing here, you know, this is something new. This is something big. Uh, you know, you feel like you're in a very special spot. You know what I
Dan Ryan: mean? Yeah. And then was there anything, like if you were to look at the Aldo from before, that indoctrination and the, with the Schrager team?
And specifically Ian, cuz I've see him as such, like a visionary, different thinker. Like how, how has that singular person changed the way you look at things? Um,
Oswaldo Barrios: I will say, you know, like, like what a little bit of what I was telling you before about the way you see the whole luxury, um, you know, luxury design [00:21:00] and luxury experience on a hotel.
You know, that's definitely changed. I seen it. And, and also, um, I would say, you know, give me a little bit of window into, into perhaps a world I wasn't too familiar with you in terms with design, high level design. You know, having the opportunity to work with very good designers, um, and really being involved on the, on the process, you know, to a certain level, working as a team with them.
Um, you know, just to give you a little bit of history, for example, we started our first project that we. Worked on, it was, uh, probably in Waikiki called the, the Waikiki Edition. It was Ya Design. So first time, you know, working with a, with a firm like ya, which is really, really interesting. Um, and, and honestly learning a lot about what they were doing and how they were approaching things and all that and, and, you know, the beautiful level of drawings they had and so much detail.
And, you know, coming from [00:22:00] an architectural point of view with you, the details are more like construction details and window flashing and this and that. Suddenly you are in detail, you know, pieces of furniture and this I so, so interested and so like, you know, going to much level of detail that, uh, that, uh, I wasn't used to that.
I found that really, really, really, um, engaging, you know?
Dan Ryan: Um, that's amazing. Especially as a, as a trained architect where it's all about the details, right? Yeah. Who was it? Who said God is in the details? Is that Meese, Vanderau or someone like that? Yeah, but like, I feel like, and that, but that's really, is that where your appreciation, the ideas of stage really made you that kind of convert and ra raving fan of interiors?
I think so, and, and you know what
Oswaldo Barrios: the part of it is, is what I think Ian and the recent team does really well is that, uh, the design is based is, is what we call an architectural design, which sometimes [00:23:00] I don't like that expression, but it means the architecture is really important. On, on, on what you design.
And you know, for example, you see one of, or some of our hotels, you'll see that there is a stair that is really iconic. You know, we have it in, um, in, um, uh, clock tower in New York. One the persons as you come out to the restaurant, and that we did some of the times. The last one that, uh, we did was in Madrid edition, which is actually the store that takes you from the drop off to the lobby, which is in a different level.
And, uh, it's just a beautiful square space, wooden space with a wide stair coming out of it, you know? So it is, it is very architectural because there's no pieces of furniture. There's no this, it's not that, you know, I mean, there is no details at it. It's just the basic architectural that's giving you the wow and the, and and that sense, you know, the way lit, uh, the one you two when you went.
Makes you feel you want to go up the stairs and see what's up [00:24:00] there, you know? Uh, so it is, um, it is an architectural kind of, uh, way to look at things and, and you know, like when I was talking about the other, the more traditional, uh, luxury design, it's more about what you add to the space. You know, you have a wall and you have this, and you had a pattern.
And I say you put layers and layers of things, you know, uh, and the work we do, there's not layers. It's just a very bold but simple statements, you know, on the spaces. And I think that's, that's something that I, I learned that I didn't, you know, or I learned to have the appreciation now than before. You know, the one thing that I always think is that, you know, to work on a brand like this, um, and you're not until designer of the brand, you have to have a huge appreciation for what they're doing because in a way you feel like you are protecting them in a little bit.
Um, you know, or you find yourself, when I'm on my role of a, um, um, Design management, product management, you know, you're dealing with, [00:25:00] you know, The, the air conditioner system, the plumbers, you know, the engineers and all that. And then you have the design team here trying to do this really perfect, beautiful work.
And you're kind of like, you know, sometimes you get into like a protective mode because you know, you're fighting with the engineer, you know, you need that drill, you know, but we're like, okay, how can we hide it? Can, how can we make it better? All that? Because I know that for the design, it's a really important piece, you know, so it's, uh, I, I think that's part of, um, the learning through the, through the process, through the working on addition.
Um, another really important piece of, of, uh, I think of our team, um, maybe the designers will appreciate a little bit of this, is that, uh, everybody has a role and everybody knows what the role is on the, on the overall piece. And, um, that's really important, you know, The designer is the designer, and, and then you have to [00:26:00] protect the roles of everybody.
So you get a, a really much more, um, stronger piece at the end of the, you know, you don't get a mishmash of a little bit of everything.
Dan Ryan: Hmm. And have you always been, cuz I've heard you say protective a lot, it's almost like I'm getting the feeling that, you know, you're protecting this part to let that nurture or evolve or grow in some way.
And then this one is you're nurturing over here and over here, but it all kind of comes together into this congress of something very unique, which is what I think addition has were, did you always approach projects that. Um,
Oswaldo Barrios: not, not previously, to be honest. Not, not, uh, until I started on this on addition.
Um, I know hospitality path, you know, I've done all the work aside ion, that's what I say, just hospitality in general. [00:27:00] But, um, but I think it's really important. You know, I think, um, on, on the hospitality world, what we, and we as, as a myriad, as a, uh, Samira hospitality company, the, the big strengths that we have is in the brands that we have.
You know, that's, that's our company strengths and protecting those brand is, is, you know, is what we should do is, uh, you know, there's things, there's things that need to work, you know what I mean? But it doesn't mean that it needs to be obvious, but, but you know, their condition needs to work. The water has to be hot, you know, that needs to happen no matter.
But at the end of the day, what is gonna bring the, the, the, the people and, and the focus on the brands is what's happening, where you filled in and where you've seen, you know, as an interior design, part of the design of the spaces and side of the hotel. So, uh, that's what I think we need to protect that.
We need to
Dan Ryan: walk towards that. Yeah. And then I know I, I asked a bunch of questions about, [00:28:00] you know, how Schrager Yeah. And his team helped marry and you evolve and grow and, you know, using that spear point as a, as a metaphor on the other side. If you were to ask Ian, having worked with Marriot and built this edition brand, and how, how do you think Marriot, you and Marriot helped, um, helped Ian Schrager and his team evolve?
Oswaldo Barrios: That's a tricky question, I guess. I mean, you have to ask them for sure, but, uh, um, I think through the years and through the process of doing things, I think, uh, there's been a learning from both sides. You know, of course we'll learn a lot from, from what they do. And I think they also have learned from what we do in terms of, you know, um, our expertise and.
The hospitality world in terms of the operations, in terms of [00:29:00] the, of the, even to the physical, you know, like I was saying, it's, it's not what the guest converts, you know, having the hot water in the, in the building, but, but how important that is as part of the, the complex of the hotel. You know, I think they learn that part of it, and, and I will, I would like to say that they have a little more respect on, on what that, um, but all that kind of machine behind the scenes is doing for the hotel, you know?
Mm-hmm. . Um, but, um, yeah. And then,
Dan Ryan: and then as you, as you know, as you're kind of on this path with addition and Marriot going forward and how your experience has evolved and really looking at not only the details but the experience. Of all these different elements of a stage. Mm-hmm. , um, and you look at the path, you guys are path are paving forward.
What's exciting you most [00:30:00] about what lays ahead of you and Marriot? You know,
Oswaldo Barrios: um, I will have to say, see in addition, growing and growing, you know, um, like I told you, when we started, we had one property in Waikiki. Then we had another property in, uh, in Istanbul, which was a real interesting project. And then, so what happened at that time?
Then the recession came, I say 2009 and 10, I guess. Can't remember. So, so at that point, the company decided to invest some of the money into pushing the, the brand forward, you know, because the, the market in general for, for owners wasn't, uh, was dried out cause of the recession. So company went ahead and bought three buildings.
One in London, the Burners hotel, uh, the clock tower in New York, uh, and Madison Park, and then, uh, in, uh, Miami Beach, the civil hotel. And there were three existing buildings, [00:31:00] um, in which we've renovated you. First was London, then Clock Tire, which was a really, really interesting project. Uh, this was, I dunno if you're familiar with it, it is a MetLife building, uh, on Madison Square that saw the tower itself is what the hotel is.
And, uh, from a used,
Dan Ryan: I used to live right around the corner. I was on 20th, uh, and seventh, so I'm very familiar with the whole story. Yeah. But keep going. Yeah.
Oswaldo Barrios: Yeah. So, so I mean the, the, the tower was, you know, built, was a tallest tower in New York for I know how long for, for months maybe, but, um, but the whole building was, yeah, it was a competition, but the whole building was the left building.
And, and then what happened is that, uh, The company bought the, the tower only, of course not the building. So it was a little bit of a surgical separation from the systems and all that from technical side to separate the tower from the, from the building itself. But the big [00:32:00] challenge on the towers, such a small footprint, and then you of whole hotel vertically guest rooms is not that hard in a sense that, you know, small spaces.
But when you get to the whole, um, public spaces and functioning of the hotel, it becomes a big challenge because everything is vertical. You know, all the services back us and all that is stuck in small areas all throughout, I don't know, 10 storages of the building on the back. So, um, so that was really, you know, that really gave, gave us a really.
Confidence internally, say the companies really committed to this brand and we're gonna be developing, or we're gonna put the money into it. Of course, the other set of is, you know, developing these projects, uh, with a company investment was a little bit more stressful than, than any other project . Cause you have a lot of eyes looking at what you're doing.
But it, it was a beautiful experience and, and we're really happy with the project. So you, you are, look, you are asking me what I look forward to. I, I look [00:33:00] forward to, to this brand growing and more and more. Um, you know, we, we covered a really good, um, piece of the, piece of the business in terms of, uh, um, resorts.
You know, we have a resort in boardroom that we did, uh, uh, beat up in maybe about four years now before pandemic. So we did that project, it's doing really well. We did another one in China, in H Island. Edition that's doing really well also. So it's, um, it's a little bit of an organic growing, you know, you know, there's interesting places and we go there and we do, you know, the little team moves forward to there, to there, to there and develop this, this, um, this hotel.
But on the future I just such, you know, I'm really excited to see how this whole thing grows and, and the, and the brand really keep established in itself and, um, becoming this
Dan Ryan: iconic thing, you know? Yeah. And then the growth is [00:34:00] amazing. And if you look at, if you look at the projects that are, that could be spoken about that are on the horizon, are there any in particular that you're most excited about?
Oswaldo Barrios: Yeah, yeah, there's some that really, I mean, You don't wanna play favorites, ?
Dan Ryan: No. You love, you love all your children equally .
Oswaldo Barrios: But, uh, we have a, we're working on one in Lee Ko is a really exciting project that we're gonna be working on. Um, we, we already started designing all that, so that's really, really exciting.
Billing is exciting. The location is, you know, can compare . Uh, so we have that one. And, you know, that's, that's, you know, there's, there's all ones around. We do another, uh, we have two more, uh, resorts in Mexico. One in Canna, which is gonna open next year. Uh, it's beautiful, beautiful hotel sitting on mangroves.
Wow. And then you just walk to the beach and come [00:35:00] back and everything's like, kind of floating into this green space. It's beautiful. So, you know, those, those very, very, uh, special places, but the hotel go, that's, you know, that's something that, you know, that, that. It's really, really exciting to see how it keeps going and
going.
Dan Ryan: And as well though, I know I'm, I know you mentioned the complexity of kind of partitioning off the clock tower from the rest of the MetLife building to do the New York edition. If you look back over all of the additions that you've worked on wearing your architect hat and, and also describing all those details, which one do you think was the most challenging of all of them and.
Uh, clock tower for sure. Oh, really? Okay.
Oswaldo Barrios: Clock tower is really challenging building. Um, like I tell you, ski footprint, there was, there was a historic building, so we needed to respect the outside of the building. Internally. We only had, uh, one floor that was [00:36:00] preserved, which is where the restaurant is for the second floor.
Mm-hmm. . So there used to be the offices for midlife, um, executive, uh, staff. Uh, so there's some beautiful wood, you know, um, details and huge fireplace and where the main office for the ceo, whatever president was. Um, but that was the most difficult one. Technically. I mean, one of the things, for example, we had to replace all the stairs because the stairs didn't comply with code.
So the, you know, it were some days that you go into the building and you look up and you'll see. 10 store space inside the building where the new sails gonna be placed. You know, cause you had to remove sections of the structure. You couldn't do it all at once because the building will will. Oh my goodness.
So you have to do it by sections, this section then the only one, then this one and then the other one. I don't think so. Um, even the mechanical, the way the mechanicals, um, have to be laid out, you know, it has to be drawn in a sort of metric in perspective [00:37:00] to see how you could transfer the dock work and all that.
This, so it, it wasn't really a really, um, exciting and difficult. And, and you know, we spend, we used to go to a. Or our meetings every week, uh, on Thursdays. You know, I spend the whole day on Thursday in New York, uh, you know, attending the meetings and all that. But it was, was very exciting is, uh, wow. From an architectural point of view, it was really real interest.
And then seeing how the old interiors kind of layer into this space was really beautiful.
Dan Ryan: Yeah, it's an amazing hotel. You beautiful. Oh yeah. I was actually, I just had drinks there a couple weeks ago with a friend of mine and, um, it's, it's awesome. I love it every time I walk into that, it's such an iconic property and it's hard to believe that it's not that old.
And it, I feel like it when I walk in there. I feel like it was always meant to be a hotel, and it's wild to me that it, that it isn't. So, uh, if [00:38:00] anyone ever has a chance, you're ever around Madison Square Park in New York City, just go. I highly recommend. Go check it out, see if some rooms are available and see, um, as well though, as you're.
Looking to the future in these new, exciting projects that are on the horizon. Um, and you're kicking them off cuz I, you know, they're all architecturally interesting and have their own levels of complexity. When you get a new project on your table, what excites you most about a new project? And then what's also like, What's the most challenging part at the onset of a new project for you?
So it's kind of that double edged sword. It's super exciting, but from your experience on all the additions that you've worked on, yeah. This is the most, this is the most challenging part of getting all these people to work together.
Oswaldo Barrios: Yeah. I think, you know, the, the, I mean the market science part of course is where the hotel is gonna be.
That's always, you know, the location is, is a highlight, you know? Um, and, um, if you have an [00:39:00] existing building, even though you know it's gonna be very complicated to resolve, it's always exciting about seeing an existing property and, and going through it and seeing if we can fit things in. And, you know, hiding the, the building, I mean, the flu ceiling has enough to get a room in there.
Can you get a lobby? Can you, we demolish this slab and get a larger space here? You know, that, excuse me. That's always very exciting. Um, uh, the hardest part is usually getting, uh, The teams and donors to understand all the non-public areas that you need to, to service a, a product. Well, you know what I mean?
You get into, you know, the, usually the first time you, you see a, a set of drawings, you know, there's probably in back house, you know, they might be an office here and then, you know, housekeeping there and that's it. And I mean, when you have a team that knows hospitality before you know that they know what they're getting [00:40:00] into it.
But most of the time when you get an owner, you have to like, start stressing about, um, how the whole machine works together, you know? Um, and how, you know, always, you know, insist on them, you know, so, and, and to the point about having a luxury experience, you know, a luxury experience requires a certain amount of spaces, a certain amount of people to, to deliver that experience.
You know, you cannot deliver experience and with, if you don't have the, the proper, um, You know, uh, facilities back there, you know, if, if you have
Dan Ryan: that, that's actually super interesting to me because if you think about, if I were gonna build an addition hotel, you know, it's a statement piece. It's all about using your stage metaphor that you brought up.
It's a, it's a stage for all the guests and the neighborhood or location that's around or like check out this really cool new, unique property. But I'll also say, and I love that you talked about the back of the house because from all the additions that [00:41:00] I've been in, the people working there, it's that kind of different type of luxury you were talking about at the beginning of the conversation.
I love that you said, oh, we gotta really think about what's happening back of house. Cuz that's the stage you have to build for them because that's how you attract the right people that can, you know, be the, the stage hands and the, and the experience for the guests that are coming through. Because I don't know, I.
I remember a, a, I don't know their names, but I, I just remember a lot of interactions with unique interactions with people that have worked at edition hotels. It, it must really help with, um, the recruiting and, and the overall culture of the properties as well.
Oswaldo Barrios: Yeah. You, you, you hope so. I mean, as aspect so that I, you know, our, our, um, operations team does a great job of, on the part about the culture of the brand and, and getting people, and getting people really engaged and excited about what they're [00:42:00] doing.
You know, this, this is not just a job, this is actually a, you know, there's more than just a job and, and. And, um, you know, serve drinks in a bar. You know, there's a lot of it, um, a lot more. Um, and, and you gotta get people to understand that and, and that enjoys that as well, you know, because they have to have enjoyment that you can actually feel from them when you're sending you the drink or, or, you know, helping you on the checking desk.
Um, so they do a great job for that. Um, and, um, And, and the part of the design that we try to, you know, we try to pay a little bit of attention is that when you designing the, the back of house, you know, the changing rooms, you knows something. I always goes consist with the, with the teams, you know, you know, so, you know, there's no difference.
It's manage to the bunny, you do it in, in the, in the guest room upstairs. You know, you have to be able to put makeup on me, so don't gimme a little ball and one exposed ball in front of me. You know? So, I mean, you have to really set up this nicely. If you wanna somebody to be look great and, and [00:43:00] they can feel the look great, then go back into the, into the hotel feeling that way.
So it's, it's so part of that building that, that, um, it's a little bit of an experience if you think about it that way. For the, from the back of house, of course, there usually no budget for it, . So yeah, you, you know, there's no mind for everything. But there is, there's a lot of ways you can do it with a proper planning.
Um, To get, you know, a nice, you know, cafeteria or whatever, employee cafeteria, where there is not just the food, but people can see it and check the emails in order and the Braves and you know, it's a nice environment. You know, sometimes we like to say that we, we like to bring a little bit of the design of the hotel into the, into the cafeteria downstairs.
Uh, in some price you have used, uh, materials left over from the construction or you know, there's some rejects, some repair has to be done. Just make that material. We use it here, we can, you know, we can do something here with it. It's part of that, um, part of that, um, bringing that, [00:44:00] uh, that experience to the place as well, you know?
Dan Ryan: Oh yeah, keep going.
Oswaldo Barrios: One thing that you said that, uh, that is definitely, I learned a lot working in merit, that you really get an appreciation for the people that work in the hotels, uh, doing this work and going through the pre-opening process and, you know, everybody's kind of, you know, On deck trying to, uh, finish it and helping what I can do, what I can do you, when you're on the five, on those last few days, um, the reopening, so you really develop really strong relationships with the teams and the GMs and all that.
So it's, it is really, um, it's really a team effort that goes beyond the front house. Totally.
Dan Ryan: Yeah. Opening hotels is, it's amazing. Like you're basically handing over the keys to this incredibly complex machine that is still figuring itself out. All the different systems, all the different people, just getting everything to work in Congress so that when a guest walks in and it's really [00:45:00] just a, they don't notice anything, um, that's a real art.
And all those, all those teams that specialize in the opening of hotels, I mean, they're, they're a really inter, like a very rare breed of people because it's not only the. The crucible of the schedule to open, but you're also troubleshooting everything that could go wrong. It's insane.
Oswaldo Barrios: At the same time, you know what, what we call the, you know, the countdown time, you know, the, you know, the, the training that happens right before they open and all that is, you know, we, as, as a part of the global design piece, were kind of onsite, but doing other things.
You know, I mean, doing the punch work in this and not solving last minute issues, but we get to, um, to, uh, witness and participate in some of that. And it's really, really, uh, exciting. You know, when you meet everybody and, you know, there is, there's, uh, one part of the opening where the, uh, there is a fashion show with all the uniforms and all that and this, [00:46:00] and it's, it's so great.
Yeah. Oh, that's
Dan Ryan: fun. Um, as well though, if I were to do, if I did my math correctly, you started with addition 15 years ago. Yep. So is that 2007 or six?
Oswaldo Barrios: 2007. October, 2007 actually. Oh, wow.
Dan Ryan: So now that I keeping , you're better at math than, you're better at math than me. Um, if, if the oswaldo I'm talking to right now were to stand in front of the Oswaldo, who had no hospitality experience, basically was tasked with bridging the gap between this enormous hotel company and this really entrepreneurial, um, visionary boutique hotelier.
What advice would the Aldo that I'm speaking to right now give the Aldo of 2007.
Oswaldo Barrios: Oh [00:47:00] wow. Okay. Um,
Advice. You know, I would say, um, I would say, you know, really get, um, or somebody that we're in that position, I would say is really learn, not sort everything you can from, from this, from the EM team and the end, uh, way of thinking and, uh, and addition, uh, tructure, all that because, you know, this is, this is an opportunity that, you know, not everybody gets.
So, you know, just realize where you are and enjoy it and, you know, absorb everything you can. .
Dan Ryan: Yeah. And, and I know you absorbed it because you're, you're still there and you're doing great work. And if you were to look at all the different things that you've absorbed [00:48:00] actually before, I think I go into the all the different things.
Do you think. The Oswaldo of 2007 was as open to absorbing everything as the Aldo of now. Like did you know what you were getting into with the Schrager team? Oh no, I have no idea. ,
Oswaldo Barrios: I have no idea. Like I told you, I mean, I was really new to the hospitality and uh, even to the design, you know, I dunno how you call it, high level design or whatever you wanna call it.
Um, so, uh, no, I didn't know what was getting into it, you know? Uh, I was just trusting my instinct that said, this is something interesting, something different to I've been doing, so I'm going for it. Um, but that's as much as I knew. And, and, and to be honest, I don't think a lot of people knew what the, the end result was gonna be or the, you know, the process was gonna be it far.
Like everybody was kinda, okay, let's do it. I'm talking about internal in married, you know? Yeah, let's do it. Let's try to figure out. And you figure out, you figure it out.
Dan Ryan: [00:49:00] And also, you know, Kudos to Mr. Marriot for being able to kind of be the mad scientist of putting these two ingredients together too.
Right. So, so this was
Oswaldo Barrios: actually, um, as much as Mr. Marriott as a Einstein's uh, um, baby, you know, I think he was, he was crucial and he was really engaged in this brand, and, and I think he protected a lot of the brand. Uh, you know, especially in the early days when, you know, there was a lot of, you know, internal discussions and this, and do we do this, you know, we're spending money on, on those three properties that that is company money.
Should we spend more money to do this and stuff. These things that Ian, things are valuable for the project. And I say, okay, maybe they're not as valuable. We need to read some of it, you know, so he was really, um, critical in those discussions and, and, and having the vision, you know, he really had a vision for what this brand could be.
Dan Ryan: Um, oh, see, okay. That's interesting because [00:50:00] when we were first talking, I thought, I, I was picking up from you that it was, um, Mr. Maria, um, but Arnie, I think the industry really misses him. Oh, yeah. I, I think he was just an incredible visionary. Um, and I actually didn't realize that he was so protective in the birth of this brand as well, to let it kind of nurture and throwing extra money at
Oswaldo Barrios: it.
Yes, yes, he was. And you know, when I said about Mr. Mayor, cause you know, when the, in those days, Arnie wasn't the CEO yet. Uh,
Dan Ryan: what was his position then? Um,
Oswaldo Barrios: geez, I can't remember.
Hmm. You know, I'll owe you, I email you that
Dan Ryan: Yeah, you email me that, but wow. So he, he, even as not the CEO, stepped up and was like, no, we have to, we have to protect this. This is part of the vision and we have to make this happen. We have to birth this. Correct.
Oswaldo Barrios: Yeah. Correct. Um, yeah, because [00:51:00] I guess what, I can't remember, I had to, to let you later what the roles exactly were, but Mr.
Mayor was really involved in the whole process. At the beginning, what we were doing, for example, clock tower, you know, we develop clock tower. He was really involved and we will sit down and review the plans and what are we doing on this floor? We wanna do it on the top of the tower. How you gonna do that space and all that.
So it was really engaged in that at that time. So it was, um, it was as much as, uh, his, his input to the protection that, uh, Arnie, um, provided to, um, to the brand that was really important. Yeah. Wow.
Dan Ryan: And then to think, well also to use that kind of spearhead as addition as a, you know, the trailblazer for Marriot to kind of fill in all these other brands.
Obviously they acquired Starwood and that brought on a lot of brands as well, that they had to, you know, figure out how it all worked together. Yeah. Um,
Oswaldo Barrios: I, yeah, so what I said, you have to think about me in 2007. It was, yeah. [00:52:00] Very different to what it is right now.
Dan Ryan: Totally. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. It's nowhere near the same company.
It's, it's evolved so much and that evolution and trajectory. I mean, so much of that was Arnie. Right. And I, I've actually, I've never, ever, ever heard anything but just accolades or appreciation about Arnie Sorenson. Yeah. That's
Oswaldo Barrios: amazing. Great, great, um, leader and uh, you know, I mean, you probably hear this many times, but you know, you were, you were walking on the hallway with, you know, and I see him on the hallway and, you know, it's so, so warm and hello.
How you doing? You know, there was always, you know, you felt like it was one of the other guys on the, on the building, even though he was some media. Uh, but, um, he was a very approach person, you know, to be in
Dan Ryan: position, you know? Well, I, you know, I think going back to the [00:53:00] beginning of the conversation where just Schrager and Marriott just seemed like such odd bedfellows, but it really, I, it really just paved the way for so much at the trajectory of Marriott and Marriot, you know, being a cornerstone.
Of our industry, right, of the big brands, like they're definitely one of the, the, the biggest and really influential. But, you know, there's so many of them all work together. I think it helped all the other ones kind of have to shift and kind of really think about what they do in the boutique, um, lifestyle space as well.
And it's just been an, an incredible, um, evolution to watch, an inspiration, to watch to for everyone. Uh, and it's really cool that you've been a part of it from the very beginning with with, with no preconceived notions and you just kind of jump right in and it helped guide it. Yeah, I feel
Oswaldo Barrios: very, very fortunate actually to, to have been on that spot.[00:54:00]
the right place at the right time, I guess. But, um, yeah, it is, and, and, and, you know, you see how hard it is to actually create a brand from scratch, you know, it's, it is a, it is a uphill battle and, and, you know, expensive and messy and , but, uh, but a great experience.
Dan Ryan: And then I guess another question is like, creating a brand from scratch and how difficult it is.
If you were to stack up all the thi all the difficult parts of making a brand, as you look in the rear view mirror, which one of those did you learn the most from? Or what was the most, what was the most difficult part about building a brand? And, and how did you learn from that? How did, how did they help you grow?
I, I think,
Oswaldo Barrios: you know,
From, from a design point of view, I think it's been, you know, [00:55:00] it is been, like I told before, a little bit of an organic process. You know, if you look at the properties early on, uh, what your case's not there anymore. But, uh, if you looked at that to, to what burn was in, in London to clock Tower, there is a little bit, you know, from a, from a high level design point of view, there's a little bit of like trying to find a way top on the design, and then you can see how that kind of gets more and more focused, a STEM goes by.
Um, and I think we are, we're in a point where there is a much more stronger, uh, brand, uh, you call it identity or brand experience that perhaps wasn't as, as, um, As defined early on, you know, so, so that's been a, a huge, um, learning that I appreciate, you know, in terms of, you know, putting together a brand, you know, let it, kind of, let it happen and let it breathe and let it, uh, finally delivers its own way.
Um, in, in that sense. The other things [00:56:00] that I think's, not a design piece, but, uh, you know, having the right partners to do it, you know, getting the right, um, owners, you know, as you know, Mary, the brands were the operators for the, I mean, the buildings were the operators, uh, of the hotels. So, um, having the, the, uh, the right partners that they're willing to invest and, and appreciate what you do as really important.
You know, what the brand, it's, it's kinda like some sense is not a brand for everybody type of thing, you know, it's like, right.
Dan Ryan: It also, it goes back to that old adage of. You know, when you're creating or when you're trailblazing or planning something, sometimes perfect is the enemy of good. Right? You gotta like get all those parts together and just get good going and then it evolves into perfect.
Oswaldo Barrios: Yeah. Yeah. Although I will say we're really, really and our owners will tell you the, tell you that we really, really [00:57:00] striving for. Perfect. But, um, but it's part of you, it's part of the process. You know, we, we just want to have the best, the best that can be, you know, and then we really, uh, we have learned from Ian and from his team to be really focused on detail and, and, and not giving up a little bit in a sense.
Like, you know, like you said, you know, okay, it's not acceptable. It has to be better than that. You know, can we just be okay? You know, this is not a you. It's, that's, that's not what we do type of thing, you know? So yeah. So that's, that's been, um, uh, an experience as well. A learning experience. Okay, cool.
Dan Ryan: Um, well, as well, this has been really fantastic.
If people wanted to learn more about addition or connect with you, what's the best way for them to do that?
Oswaldo Barrios: Uh, no, reach out to me. LinkedIn, you know, I'm on LinkedIn, so, um, or I can also give you my, um, my email afterwards so you can post it, so, so people can [00:58:00] check it out. But yeah, that's, uh,
Dan Ryan: I'll also put the addition, um, we'll put all the addition website up there so that
Oswaldo Barrios: people can see what's I, I, I recommend everybody that has an additional close by.
Just go have a drink or have a, you know, if it's not, um, a stay, at least a visit because it's really a good experience. So, yeah,
Dan Ryan: I, I, I can vouch for that as well. Uh, well as well though, I wanna. Firstly, thank you. I mean, this has just been really wonderful to kind of peer behind the curtain of how these two different ideas came together to create something really cool and, and kind of open up bandwidth and Yeah, and experience to what, what else is possible.
And again, like from 2007 to now, it's, Marriot is just a, it's a different, different whole different world.
Oswaldo Barrios: Yeah. Yeah. Well, thanks for having me. This has been great. I mean, it's, it's kind of fun to go back, you know, in time and just think about things, [00:59:00] you know, your questions are making me kind of like, uh, put things in context and kind of like revisit things and all that.
So it's great.
Dan Ryan: Wonderful. And also, I'd be remiss if I didn't thank our listeners. Um, again, we keep growing people are really into all these conversations that we're having. Every week we get a little bit bigger. So, uh, thank you. And if. This has changed your perception on what hospitality is and how to create spaces where hospitality flourishes or new ideas of what hospitality are.
Please share the podcast with a friend because we've been growing by word of mouth. So, uh, everyone thank you and we'll see you next time.